Abandoning the past and starting over would be fine if the old story had been FINISHED properly.

Armageddon didn't wrap up anybody's personal subplots, it just killed everybody. That's not a satisfying resolution.



Sir, I can show you, point by point, every way in which MK9 is a sloppy, poorly written script full of plotholes and things that don't make sense.

But do you REALLY want this? It's a really, REALLY long read. You will probably get bored and give up in the middle.

Also, I find some people when faced with criticism that tears down something they liked, will dismiss the points as nitpicking (and to be fair, some of my points are that but many are much larger and more important), because they WANT to like the thing, and are automatically set to reject anything that inspires thought to the contrary.

Yeah, but that's the resolution you've been given, so...yeah....

Lol Cyber Sub-Zero tribute to fans.

It wasn't a very satisfying storyline either, so that makes sense to me. The entire idea was "And then, every single character dead or alive races to the top of a pyramid, killing each other in the process, where they fight this big dude who is on fire that was once a background figure in MK2." ..."But wait, here are another two painfully bland characters we'll throw at you to justify it."

Armageddon in itself felt like NRS saying, we have no fucking clue where to go from here. I'm glad that, rather than try to piece together that shit show into something that resembles an actual story, they decided it was time to admit they fucked up and abandon ship.

I've never even considered that MK was a series where it's characters would have resolution because resolution is the antithesis of fighting, and at the end of the day it's a game where people fight. I can only speak for myself, but I thought the storylines for MKDA-MKA were shit, and I'm glad to be rid of them. As far as Cyber Sub-Zero, are people really still crying about that? He's basically a one off. You're going to point at him and say MK9 is a bust? You guys realize no one actually cares right? Sub-Zero is back to being Sub-Zero, whichever one he is, and Sub-Zero in his traditional form is still in MK9. How could they possibly ruin the sanctity of a series that doesn't even take itself seriously? Mortal Kombat has never made sense, it has always been inconsistent. The story has always been a means to an end, not the raison d'etre.

Mortal Kombat 9 did many things to destroy the MK mythology. Here is video that does a good job at explaining some the problems with MK9's story:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LH2UjnAJrNA

Myself , I found many more things wrong with MK9 story mode and characters. I don't feel like typing a essay. To fans who have paid attention to the storyline after all these years, MK9's storymode is pretty much " Mortal Kombat Annihilation" level storytelling.

Raiden sending a message to himself all the way back to Mortal Kombat 1 era was dumb, considering things went wrong during the Mortal Kombat Deadly Alliance era, mainly because of the death of Liu Kang. Also , the "He must win message " was so so bad, to set up the plot. Why didn't Raiden say, Liu or Kang must win instead of just ,he? Again, why would Raiden, allow Liu Kang to win again in the past only to get killed again at the hands of the Deadly Alliance, assuming he never interfered? Why did the Elder Gods interfere in the alternate timeline, whereas they allowed Kahn to kill Blaze in the original?

The character personalities are wrong, characters backstrokes were wrong(Milieena and the original Sub-Zero mission to name a few), characters that appeared in MK1 that should not have been in there, such as Nightwolf, the PIT2 is located in the wrong place, Shao Khan's invasion is all WRONG(why are humans fight monsters, Khan's invasion is supposed to suck EVERYONE'S soul up), only the chosen ones were supposed to be alive, why is Quan Chi walking around with Shinnok's amulet.

MK9's story mode is no fan service.

Because he meant that Shao Kahn should win, not Liu Kang. Because Shao Kahn "won", he broke the rules of Mortal Kombat and was eliminated by the Elder Gods.

I can see what you're saying and to that degree, I understand, but I think there should be some slack cut. For instance, putting Nightwolf in MK1 makes it so it's not completely insane that there is a walking Native American stereotype showing up out of nowhere in MK3. MK9 is an effort to consolidate and rearrange elements from MK1-3 in a way that NRS felt they cold build of from in the future. The whole point is that they want to change the past, both literally, and on the meta level of shit in MK getting so out of hand they had to corral it all into a more feasible storyline. MK9 is NRS way of saying, this is the way it should have gone down. I do understand that some people may disagree with how NRS feels it should have gone down, and I don't begrudge them, but I disagree.

I don't think of MK as the sort of literal, serialized, everything matters type of storytelling. I think of it more like comics, where everyone sort of has their take at the story, and conflicting things in the past have happened, but as time goes on certain things are made canon and other things arent. At a certain point it was canon that Batman carried a gun, but now it's not. Does that mean Batman should carry a gun because at one point that was expected and normal? No. Likewise, MK has to evolve and change with the times. Every time it holds steadfast to obscure minutia of past games, it's hindering itself in the future.

Ok, if MK9 fucked everything up soooooo badly, then........why are you here? Why are you and Razor following MKX at all? According to you two, the original plot has just been ripped to shreds, and it's so horrible, and this new direction/retelling isn't even half as good as the original.

So...what's your purpose here? Wouldn't it make more sense for you *not* to be here, considering how much you hate the new MK?

I'm genuinely curious, mind you. This is no attempt to troll.

Seriously, why?

Because complaining about how the good old days used to be better automatically makes you a truer fan.

Why did they wait till the end? Also, in the new timeline, Sindel was reborn in Outworld. In the old timeline she was reborn on Earth, which made the invasion was possible. Also, in the old timeline, the Elder gods , including Raiden didn't interfere(not counting "depowered" Raiden in MKT.) The only time in the old timeline were the Elder gods interfered when when they give up their status.

You see how MK9 made a huge mess of things?

It only makes a mess of things if you took that shit so seriously in the first place. Which I guess it any fan's perogative, but if you're getting wrapped up in which realm Sindel was reborn in, maybe you'd be better of applying those energies to something that takes itself more seriously.

Noticed how he ignored me? Now, he'll likely play it off as "the question wasn't important enough" or "I don't respond to newbies (D'vorah might actually have a point there)".

But the truth is, he doesn't have an answer...

And I can explain why all your arguments are nothing, but fanboish attempts to pass your headcanon as real deal, my good man.
No hard feelings.

And, by the way, actually waiting for a resolution of the story in an ongoing fighting game...? You can't be that....serious, right? Because, the story will continue as long as series sells. There will no be resolution, because new stories will be written, characters will be killed and ressurected according to the popularity (you know - this little thing that brings money) and story will go on and on, until it becomes another convoluted mess, in which new fans will not be able to get into. And then series will be rebooted. You constantly forgetting that MK is ot your headcanon and that its not an example of high literature. This is just a video game, fighting game, which have its own shortcomings, when it comes to storytelling.
So there. Time to take off nostalgia - fanboish glasses and see the real world for what it is.

Not really, the John Tobias era of storytelling give MK fans a good comic book feel. With the 3D era, Mortal Kombat and MK9 era, the series has become way too cartoon like. The biggest problem with MK9 , that it was totally unnecessary, from a storyline point of view. In fact, the first Mortal Kombat film , hit the mark far better than MK9, even with the liberties it took like including Kitana.

Mortal Kombat X sort of represents the new right direction of the series, because it did what a post Mortal Kombat Armageddon game , should have done, with out sacrificing MK mythology, like MK9. The end result of both games are the same, which is the vast of majority of characters dead, with only a few old characters returning. Why couldn't MK9 do what MKX is going to do , without making pointless the older games, is the biggest issue. ReptzMK, I didn't ignore you, I can only type so fast. Not to mention, I don't see new posts in real time, so of course I didn't respond yet.

Because obviously NRS was not happy with the post-MK3 storylines and wanted to effectively erase them or rewrite them. They would be unable to do that if they didn't change the events leading up to it. And to call those older games pointless, because, what, Smoke didn't turn into Cyber Smoke and Sindel wasn't reborn in the right realm? Give me a fucking break. If you're talking about MKDA-Armageddgon being made pointless, spoiler alert, they were pointless already.

No offense, but you making the same mistake the writers did in MK9. What does POST MK3/4 have to do with anything post MK4? Mortal Kombat Deadly Alliance was the start of a NEW story. The events in Deadly Alliance and Deception lead to Armageddon. There was no good reason to revisit the past events in MK1-MK4. The time travel plot didn't really fix anything.

What goes down with Shinnok and Quan Chi in MK4 ties directly into what happens in Deadly Alliance. Changing the events of MK4 will presumably alter everything that happens after that. Boon has already been clear that there will be repercussions for messing with the timeline, MK4-Armageddon are going to happen in a completely different way and then there will be a new storyline. It could only happen in a different way if the events leading up to it happened in a different way. And you say, oh well then, maybe Raiden should have just sent a message to his MK4 era self and changed things there, and you'd be right. But you'd also be ignoring a lot of outside factors, like NRS becoming a thing and MK getting bought by WB. It was time for a fresh start, WB needed to revitalize their property and they were resoundingly successful. I'm glad they did what they did.

Mileena just being created during MK2 and now she's mentally handicapped. WTF!?

Cybernetic Clits-Ninjas fighting a deranged Emperor-Cock that spits rainbowz...in Boston...

Nevermind.

Just wondering if anyone can see my posts, or if I'm just being ignored in general...

I can see them, I wasn't ignoring, I just didn't know how to respond to the last one, and the other one seemed more directed at someone else even though it was to me. I didn't want to incite further arguing.

I mean Razor is obviously going to blow this up with the multiple plot holes, inconsistencies, needless retcons, and shock factor storytelling of MK9 (all valid observations btw) but honestly...can we not just agree that there's people that can enjoy the MK9 story DESPITE it's obvious problems? Otherwise you're going to get a wall of text from Razor so tall the Chinese would be jealous.

Probably because he's still a fan of Mortal Kombat and still plays the games. A bit like myself, actually. I grew up loving the old story and the old timeline as well, you would do when you've been following it for the last twenty odd years. It's not something you can just swtich off after changes in one game. Every fan here, from yourself, to myself, to Razor, all became engrossed in the game for different reasons. Yes, all of the old Mortal Kombats had their vices, from gameplay to the convoluted story, but we grew to love it either way.

For me, I've always been interested in story telling. I loved the first few games: the worlds they presented, the monsters, the martial arts, the heroes, the ninja clans and the comic book infused with fantasy elements that were so predominant and distinctive compared to any other fighting game in the Arcade. Sure, it was cool spitting acid at people and trying to figure out the multiple special moves and fatalities (pre-internet days!), but what kept me hooked was the story. Even for a game that didn't take itself too seriously, there was a charm to the story and it's characters that at a young age (and even now as an adult) I resonated with and respected.

I was genuinely interested in the Lin Kuei, Sonya's history with Kano, Kitana and Mileena's rivalry, what had happened to Reptile's race: each character was unique (even if a lot were palette swaps) solely due to their stories and their place within the universe. I'd even argue the story was with dictated their gameplay to begin with. Would Mileena have had half her appeal if she was just a ninja with weird teeth? No explanations offered? Would you not be curious to know what Goro was if the game hadn't bothered to explain it? The only other fighting game of that time with any sort of semblance of story or lore was Street Fighter, and even still that pales in comparison to MK's. It was a combination of violence, shock, gore and a surprisingly interesting universe that kept Mortal Kombat a part of pop culture for the last twenty years.

For those of you who say "yeah but the story never took itself that seriously to begin with", I'd argue that's willfull ignorance. This was the only fighting game produced in the early ninties that bothered to produce any sort of media to fill in the blanks between the linear, canon story: From comic books covering MK1 up to MKD, to a successful Hollywood movie that worked closely with both Boon and Tobias (we won't speak of Annihilation). Even with Street Fighter's media, it never aimed to tie in with the games. Mortal Kombat consistently provided biographies and endings for the characters in every single game to keep the players up to date with what was going on within the game's universe, and for a game that some argue never took it's own story seriously, it made a point during the PS2 era of introducing the Konquest modes which allowed players to explore the various worlds and learn more of the game's history.

For the last twenty years, we've had a series which despite it's mistakes has made a point of making the story a focal point of the franchise. A lot of people, myself included, have grown up appreciating this. What MK2011 done was unnecessary change: Raiden's reversal of time caused changes which were never there to begin with. Sektor and Cyrax at the first tournament? Never the case. The only reason any Lin Kuei were involved in Shang Tsung's tournament was because Bi Han was hired to kill Shang Tsung, yet in MK9, he seems to be working for him. Kitana learning of her lineage from Shao Kahn? She learned it long before the events of MK2. Mileena only being born shortly before the Earthrealm invasion? Again, bullshit. She'd spent her life growing up with Kitana. These are just a handful of changes that didn't need to happen.

Fair enough if Story isn't your thing. But for those who have been following it, there's certain changes, unnecessary ones, that bother us. These are changes which have in some cases utterly lobotomised and changed the characters we've grown up loving for two decades. I'm delighted you don't see the big deal in it and that your experience of Mortal Kombat was dampened in any way (and that's not being sarcastic!), but for other fans, we've lost something with years of depth and intricacies only for it to be replaced with something that feels coughed up and violated. We might not be the types of fan you are, but none the less we are fans, and it's hard watching something you love and the things you've loved it for go totally by the way side.

Oh geez, I leave y'all for a day and come back to this...


The very fact that a fucking arcade (!) fighter (!!) gives fans such fertile grounds for speculation is already a testament to Tobias' writing skill and the strength of his vision.

But really, when you stop and think about it for a few seconds, a couple of short comic books and the five sentences worth of arcade game bios per character was enough for Tobias to establish this lush, complex universe and leave you with a solid impression of these characters' personalities and motivations. We are not inventing all of these things and character traits out of our heads. None of it is made up.

You're acting as if we're connecting the dots that aren't there. But they are there. That's why I was asking if the presence of Nolan North and cutscenes is what it takes to make it all seem "officially described" to you, because evidently, a couple of screens of ending text is not legit enough.


I can't speak for Razor, I always respected Xia as one of the biggest contributors to this community, and it's all the poorer without him around. His character analyses were one of the main reasons why I kept coming back to this place, he put an incredible amount of thought and research into his posts and was always striving to elevate the discussion beyond the usual "FUG NRS TREMOR WHEN :DD", "WUTS UR FAVRTE FATALITY1!!?" and "OMG Le NINJA RAINBOW xDD" heresy that 90% of MK boards are composed of.

If you think that none of these things deserve respect, well... I don't know what else to tell you.


You do realize that we're talking about a franchise that used to be basically Palette Swap: The Vidya, right?


He never joined Onaga. He was actively opposing him.


The entire reason why Havik leads the Earthrealm warriors, including Kabal and his cronies, straight to the Dragon King, is because he intended for them to be cannon fodder. In his ending, he sneaks over to Onaga's corpse after the others have taken him down and eats his fucking heart so that he could gain the ability to freely rez the dead at his whim, which would increase his ability to spread chaos throughout the realms tenfold.

Havik is an opportunist, a trickster and a manipulator. It's literally the crux of his entire fucking character. Why would he ever stoop to doing the dirty work himself when he can get somebody else to do it?

Are you sure you were paying attention?


Well, if you want to put it this way, no one aside from Shujinko has a real role in Konquest.


>sociopathic, cannibalistic, semi-decomposed priest who seeks to spread disorder throughout the universe by any means necessary
>actively manipulates and mindfucks others into sharing his demented worldview
>will eagerly help out the good guys if he believes that more chaos will be created as a result
>makes a promise, then gets fucking OFFENDED when somebody tries to imply that he should stay true to his word

Havik has more personality is his pinkie than half of the MK9 cast put together.


Man, I don't get you sometimes.

Just when you started being reasonable in that other thread and slowly convincing me that maybe, just maybe a completely new Sub-Zero who is not Kuai might actually be a good idea, you have to go and say shit like this.

The entire premise of MK9 is "this never happened lol!1!" Your argument might hold a shred of validity if the events that chronologically take place before the first tournament, like the entire setup for Sindel's resurrection, remained unchanged in this new continuity, but even those have been fucked with. The current writers aren't adding to the previously established lore, they are changing it at every turn whenever it's convenient and just make shit up as they go along. Nothing we know from the old continuity is true anymore.

So how in Raiden's name can you say that the lore is intact while keeping a straight face?

Or maybe Jaded was right, and you are just trolling at this point? Because I can't even tell anymore.


My favorite game in the entire fucking franchise is Deadly Alliance. So when you're telling me about the need for injecting new blood into the series, you're preaching to the choir.

I'm all for advancing the plot and boldly going forward, but taking rusty scissors to the existing storyline and violently removing the best parts of it is not the way it should be done. Are you familiar with the expression "throwing the baby out with the bathwater"? Because that's exactly what has happened here.


Are you one of those people who are convinced that the people in charge of a franchise are some kind of wise holy men who can do no wrong and should be exempt from any and all criticism?

Or are you one of those people who are convinced that just because it's a new storyline, it's automatically better than the old ones?

Because I'm honestly not sure which is worse.