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SubMan799
06/10/2010 08:23 AM (UTC)
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Chrome Wrote:
SubMan799 Wrote:
OptimusGrime Wrote:
blackcyborg Wrote:

who are you to say what is good?


If I don't, who will? Such is the cross I bare.


Was that a quote from the bible? Or did you just blow my mind?


Probably the latter given how predictable it was. :)


Never seen you make a smilie either

(>'.')>

schpoopel
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Historical Favorite
06/10/2010 08:24 AM (UTC)
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SubMan799 Wrote:
OptimusGrime Wrote:
blackcyborg Wrote:

who are you to say what is good?


If I don't, who will? Such is the cross I bare.


Was that a quote from the bible? Or did you just blow my mind?


Scanners style, yo.
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06/10/2010 08:26 AM (UTC)
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blackcyborg Wrote:
OptimusGrime Wrote:
blackcyborg Wrote:

who are you to say what is good?


If I don't, who will? Such is the cross I bare.


The arrogance...so flattering.


Because I was clearly serious. Call me Northwest, 'cause I just went over your head.
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Cyborg
06/10/2010 08:30 AM (UTC)
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OptimusGrime Wrote:
blackcyborg Wrote:
OptimusGrime Wrote:
blackcyborg Wrote:

who are you to say what is good?


If I don't, who will? Such is the cross I bare.


The arrogance...so flattering.


Because I was clearly serious. Call me Northwest, 'cause I just went over your head.


You mean you don't take the internet seriously? Interesting.
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SubMan799
06/10/2010 08:33 AM (UTC)
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smile
OptimusGrime Wrote:
blackcyborg Wrote:
OptimusGrime Wrote:
blackcyborg Wrote:

who are you to say what is good?


If I don't, who will? Such is the cross I bare.


The arrogance...so flattering.


Because I was clearly serious. Call me Northwest, 'cause I just went over your head.


Fucking amazing
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unrooolie
06/10/2010 08:52 AM (UTC)
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You want to know the full story here is an interview with the director. Here are your answers.
1. he want lui kang in it just not the main character in this story
2. Raiden will be in it
3. Mysticism will be in just not all over the place
4.Says he wants to make a movie that balances the real world with the mysticism and the special powers. Compares it to the way Harry Potter exists in two worlds. As in there are two universes that coexist with each other.
5.Confirms “fatalities” are definitely in his movie. He wants to put them in the tournament in an “organic way
6.Says Scorpion is the bad guy and will stay a bad guy

Check the interview this guy know mortal kombat just as good as all of us he is a true fan Paul W.S. Anderson i am thinking he is not


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06/10/2010 08:59 AM (UTC)
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First of all Wow...just wow. Kevin Tancharoen really did a wonderful job. It's good at least. Now, with that said here's my critique (sorta) of the actual video:

1.) Jax is a Special Forces officer, not a detective. lol I don't blame them for missing this too much, because most folks don't care to know how intricate the US Armed forces are, but I think it should be corrected because that's part of what makes Jax and Sonya "special" in the game.

He and Sonya are on a different tier of law enforcement. A good way to describe them, is that they are both officers of an outfit that is more exclusive than the US Army, Navy, and Air Force. They are the "super soldiers"....with very particular specialties. They may be martial arts masters, but Jax could be a heavy artillery specialist or rifleman, and Sonya could be tech-savvy or small arms as a specialty. Something like the crew in the first Predator movie with Arnold Schwarzenegger and his men.
Everyone had at least one specialty, but none of them were weak alone. Jax and Sonya are like the leaders of THAT small group.

The folks in the Special Forces unit are virtually untouchable (basically), and are selected for very specific reasons. Jax and Sonya should not have an office in a building anywhere . They'd have to have retired to take lessor positions like the ones in the video(and even then, their "lessor positions" would be like offices in the Dept of Defense [gov offices] or something to that affect. Which is still higher up than detective...or a precinct). They're waaay up the ladder as SF soldiers. So, to follow them through a movie sequence should be crazy as hell. It'd be alot more about stealth, strictly objectified, missions (get in, kill the target//get the info//ect, get out).

They are unseen unless they're already killing you. That's how serious these two characters are. The intensity around them should be higher just based off sheer rank, pull, talent, and skill. They survive through anything alone, and are virtually "unbeatable" together because of how they support each other.

1b.) On the flip side, the actors for Jax and Sonya were good matches. But I'd want to see a better script (more intelligent... or more catered to the actors themselves. Like, let MJWhite rehearse a fairly strict guideline about what's going on instead of sticking him to the script, he might sound better), or less of one for Jax in particular.
Even though the one for the short was pretty good as it was. It seemed a little cheezy to me. I wasn't convinced, which I think could just be how Michael Jai White speaks when it has to do with fictional characters and stuff. I love the guys work to death hands down, but he's better utilized when he doesn't speak so much. He's a better "do-er" // he's better to see rather than hear narrate through a script a whole bunch.

Sonya was good to go except for the aforementioned.

2.) Reptile was just not good man. I mean I liked how he was described, and I know now after listening to that podcast how limited resources were, but Reptile was just not good. I didn't appreciate that take on him at all.

I'd just try him again, and get alot closer to what the games offered for how to create him in the movie.

3.) No go on Baraka too, I just didn't buy it at all. I think it may be one of those situations where they naturalized//humanized this character too much. Go more like the zombies in "I Am Legend". A spin off of that might be perfect with the MK touch added to it. Teeth, skin sorta transparent with the funky veins all crazy, the blades, a large horde of them with one finite leader....ect.

I didn't like....probably anything about this interpretation of Baraka. The doctor thing...I just don't want to see it for that character.

The odd thing I find about the movie interpretations of Baraka to date, is how far off from the games' idea everyone keeps getting. He's a monster from another world...that's a fantastic idea for what this character looks like. I don't understand why producers would want to deviate from that. I'd probably just get more detailed with him...make his skin look nastier (virus infected or something), make his teeth slightly movable like the disgusting creature that he is supposed to be...

idk

4.) Johnny Cage was played great. I don't understand why he gave up so easy at the end of the fight but, all things considered I liked what they did with his backstory, and overall how he was portrayed. Plus...he got killed vs a more savage character. That was good... it made sense and everything.

Also, the choreography was decent for both of the characters too. Baraka would do what that actor did for him, and Cage would do what he did.

5.) I loved how they humanized Scorpion. I've been waiting for a long time for one of these producers to actually utilize Scorpions human name Hanzo Hassashi. The actor seemed spot on too....voice was pretty much right...ect. I couldn't wait to see him put on the ninja get-up and throw the spear. Maybe another day though.

Scorpion was portrayed well all the way through.


6.) Overall Pro:

Overall the whole vid was very well done and I appreciate the effort that went into it. I like that it was set in reality, and I liked how grounded Jax, Sonya, Cage, and Scorpion were. I also thought it felt like a new Mortal Kombat. It wasn't perfect, but it did manage to capture alot of what the allure to Mortal Kombat was about.


7.) Overall Con:

All of the characters will not be treated correctly, if a similar standard is obeyed in one reality for all of them. They're all distinctly unique so, Baraka and Reptile would almost have to play really hard to the mysticism and lore of characters like them, within the context of Mortal Kombat's fantasy element. They almost ,have to look and function like what the game gives us, or it's not gonna look or feel right.

I'm not against experimenting, but there's certain characters that shouldn't be drastically changed like they were in this pitch//short// video.

So... the "realism" works for the human characters, but not for the fantasy characters in this vid. They weren't fantastic interpretations because of the ways they needed to be humanized in order to work...they were terrible out of necessity to fit in, imo.

I think you'd almost have to play up the powers and stuff with a select couple of the characters in order for things to balance, and the best ones to pick for playing up their stuff is the purely fictional characters (like the "monsters" and a ninja or two depending on if they're being shown in human form, or ninja form).

--

That's all I got for the short film, how about that mp3?

:: I'll say I LOVE the fact that Kevin really describes how he is a fan. He gives us a good feel about what sort of fan he probably is. Which is really cool to know actually.

:: It was interesting how he used that Harry Potter metaphor. Mortal Kombat's fantasy element I think, should be everywhere in the flick, but maybe just more in some scenes than others. The first movie captured it pretty well despite other things. So, I think I'm a little weary because of that interpretation of his.
But at the same time, I appreciate it how he says there has to be rules to the choreography. I agree with there being limitations, but I think it's a matter of pandering to each character too. It was also cool he noticed that weirdness about Neo once he went CG, and then the whole unlimited special moves too.

The thing though, is seeing that balance. I'm always leery around how unnatural it looks//feels when a game character is in a movie, and happens to be throwing their special move in there for the hell of it. I don't think it's tasteful either, that "just because we haven't seen a special move in a while" some character is almost carelessly "selected" to use their moves for some reason. Organic is indeed a key.

:: It's cool purposefully picking characters. Keep going that direction.

:: The WHOLE point about Fatalities....thank you. That's a fans perspective.

:: His point about following the bad guys instead of the good-guys was good too. I'd like to see that happen.

:: When he talks about grounding Baraka, I just disagree man. Ground characters like that in their own natural element. If it's a human, ground them in "our" reality.... but if it's like a monster or something, their element wouldn't be reality, it would be in fiction or fantasy somewhere.

One of the ideas I've had for some time now that could play both ways is creating MK around this theme that is like a bad dream. It's not exactly entirely reality or fantasy, and most all...mmm....nationalities? that are in this game have a chance to breathe as organic character types within the one overall theme.

I think with MK that might be one of the keys that helps ground the "humans", and allows them to keep the "monsters" as monsters in as true-to-video game fashion as possible. I think they can co-exist, I just don't think the creators//developers//producers of these films see it quite clearly. And so they take these strange liberties, and bastardize the original character concepts completely. I don't think it's necessary.....I don't think it's proper either, for fans to have to adapt to such strange reconstructions of their fav characters for whatever reason.

If I wanna pay you for an apple, gimme THAT apple that I picked because I like it for whatever reason... That one right there. Not an orange that you colored red, and not any ol' "apple". Dig?

==

All in all this was a great update, awesome short film, and a well needed chew toy until solid game news comes around. More please....

Oh, and I would love to be the one who makes that poster he's talking about if it goes down. That would be schweetness.

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TemperaryUserName
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06/10/2010 09:14 AM (UTC)
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blackcyborg Wrote:

If you're implying that the masses don't always want something good, who are you to say what is good?

Well, if not us, then who? Ultimately, someone has to be the authority on determining artistic value.

It should also be noted that marketing, not quality (alone), determines sales. Lady Gaga sells better than Dark Tranquillity because most people don't even know the latter exists. A Mortal Kombat film wouldn't have this problem, so appealing to mass desires right off the bat wouldn't be necessary.
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Cyborg
06/10/2010 09:25 AM (UTC)
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My point is though, is that if 95% of the people saw that video and loved it and wanted THAT to be the next movie...then why not go for it? If only 5% hates that movie...oh well. That's nothing compared to how much usually hate things, especially when it comes to movies based on video games. In the end, it's about money and gaining popularity in order to get even more people to like MK and make even more money.

WB is a business. They spent a large sum of money to get MK, and the first thing they are going to want to do is make sure their property becomes a huge profit. Now if they came on here and just asked you what to make in an MK movie, and it was spot on to the games and all us hardcore fans like it and want it, but then every other casual fan and gamer/movie goer etc. thinks it looks terrible...they may make us core fans happy, but they aren't gonna make a ton of money so it would be stupid for them to do.

If you want to be successful, you can't always worry about that minority group of fans that doesn't like it, because that's innevitable no matter what you put forth.

And I agree that marketing plays a big part too, but as soon as people read reviews and find out it's crap, it doesn't matter how it's wrapped it's still gonna be a piece of shit. Keep in mind I am not saying they have to hurry up and run with this...I am saying they have a great opportunity in front of them and I think this director could make one hell of a movie if given the backing and he changed up a few things like Predator said about the grounding of mutants etc.
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Chino_Cheng
06/10/2010 10:09 AM (UTC)
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I concur TemperaryUserName.

This trailer doesn't seem to have anything to do with MK other than having the same character names.

Wasn't Baraka a takartan warrior, not some ex-surgeon gone mad, seems a little silly /mundane to me.

I suppose Sub-Zero will sell ice cream from a cart and Raiden will be an electrician.
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fedegita
06/10/2010 10:15 AM (UTC)
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Chino_Cheng Wrote:

I suppose Sub-Zero will sell ice cream from a cart and Raiden will be an electrician.


Now that you mention it, I've been racking my brains trying to come up with how they'd portray subzero without going down the really corny Mr Freeze route - ie: a scientist sucummbing to some freak accident.

Unless he just walks around with liqiud nitrogen rockets up his armsleeves.
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Cyborg
06/10/2010 10:18 AM (UTC)
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fedegita Wrote:
Chino_Cheng Wrote:

I suppose Sub-Zero will sell ice cream from a cart and Raiden will be an electrician.


Now that you mention it, I've been racking my brains trying to come up with how they'd portray subzero without going down the really corny Mr Freeze route - ie: a scientist sucummbing to some freak accident.

Unless he just walks around with liqiud nitrogen rockets up his armsleeves.


I guess nobody reads the damn interview with the director otherwise you'd know that characters will still have their supernatural powers and the mythos will still exist.
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Mick-Lucifer
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06/10/2010 10:19 AM (UTC)
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blackcyborg Wrote:
My point is though, is that if 95% of the people saw that video and loved it and wanted THAT to be the next movie...then why not go for it?

Because a sizeable percentage of the 20,000 people giving it thumbs up on YouTube probably aren't old enough to legally see a Hard R film, which already attracts a smaller audience in general, let alone when you're doing bonehead schlock with a franchise WB just paid a few mil to get, but wouldn't be representing. When there's enough of an audience to do a good martial arts movie that's PG13 or M that'll reasonably likely do better business by default.

This is the age of all the superhero films, Harry Potter, Twilight, and other faithful adaptations that draw upon a wealth of material people are excited about exploring. Why would they cut themselves out of that?

It isn'tgreat writing or creative vision. It isn't great economics.

fedegita Wrote:
Unless he just walks around with liqiud nitrogen rockets up his armsleeves.

Since Mick-Lucifer isn't here to say it... "Realism confirmed?"
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06/10/2010 11:09 AM (UTC)
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Mick-Lucifer Wrote:
... to do a good martial arts movie that's PG13


You're joking right..??
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fedegita
06/10/2010 11:21 AM (UTC)
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blackcyborg Wrote:
I guess nobody reads the damn interview with the director otherwise you'd know that characters will still have their supernatural powers and the mythos will still exist.


And if you had listened to the interview more carefully, you'd know he said any special powers would be used very sparingly to keep them "special." Therefore, since every other character was given the "realistic" treatment (even scorpion right down to his spear), then even a little common sense would tell you that Subby isn't looking like he's going to jump out spewing iceballs out of his hands. Which only begs my question further.
Don't be so naive that you believe just because he said he wants to retain some element of magic in there that the next characters we see won't be butchered beyond recognition like Baraka and Reptile were.
I really dont know what to think about it.

One part of me likes it becuase its getting the MK franchise back on the big screen.

The other says "This is not MK at all!"

Overall i dont like the approach. I would rather see somthing more like the first film but bigger, bloodier and much more involved character and story wise.
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Chino_Cheng
06/10/2010 11:28 AM (UTC)
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Yeah, a continuation of the first movie would be better.

Unfortunately it seems as though most MK fans are fucked in the head, and they seem to cater to the masses.
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Cyborg
06/10/2010 11:34 AM (UTC)
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He said the special powers would be used sparingly, he never said the characters looks wouldn't be super natural. So to think Sub would be a whole lot different than his early MK looks with his blue ninja garb is a bit odd. Hell, the only reason all the other characters weren't in their outdits was likely because A)They didn't have a big enough budget for that elaborate of wardrobes, and B)Why would the characters walk around in their daily life in combat gear? As soon as they get to the tournament I fully expect all of them would be in their getup.

That's just my opinion. I'm a bit worn out on arguing in this thread over this video which has been explained as just a simple test, so excuse me if I come off as short tempered. I'm prob. gonna take a break from it, it's been too long since I have gone on these forums and gotten this involved into a debate. lol
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fedegita
06/10/2010 11:44 AM (UTC)
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I hope he does. But from what we've seen so far it doesn't look to be the case. Then again, we can't assume vrey much considering it's a teaser for a movie that might not even get made.
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June0082
06/10/2010 11:54 AM (UTC)
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bleh is right, if this movie is anything like this i think i'm going ot cry. just kidding about the crying part, but man it doesn't even look MK to me even though it's some sort of teaser. if it does be liek this i'll just wait untilo lthe DVD comes out.
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Chrome
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06/10/2010 12:50 PM (UTC)
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Found a nice tidbit what sums up my sentiments about the situation. I love you Escapist.

Th Escapist
The Mortal Kombat movies had 2 crippling flaws. One, they were PG-13. There is no way that you could fit mortal kombat's signature violence into the movie with that kind of choke-chain. The Second problem: it followed Mortal Kombat's story. Now, I know I know, isn't the idea to follow the story?

Well...in this case it was a bad idea. The Mortal Kombat game's have a notoriously convoluted and quite silly story, as often the case in fighting games. Mortal Kombat's "universe" is only there to give an explanation as to why we have certain backgrounds and why the characters are the way they are. Is it entertaining? yes. is it well written? Oh my, no.

So, this movie is actually taking some serious chances, trying to make a coherent decent story out of a game that was built on shock value and comical levels of blood and violence. Will it succeed? We'll see. ^^
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Iguana666
06/10/2010 01:03 PM (UTC)
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It got straight to video written all over it. Whatever happened to the oriental flavor of Reptile for example? He's supposed to be a ninja right? Here, he's just some maniacal psycho and Baraka, wtf? It definitely isn't MK but it kinda reminds me of the Saw series of torture films. My, this is really bad like coming home from school and stepping on a steaming mess of stinky guano on a very hot day, lol.
Whoever said fantasy elements are for kids and boring realism is for adults? (the pitch isn't even realistic, it's corny as fuck). Movies like "Conan the Barbarian", Brian Yuzna's "Faust" were all grounded on some fantasy and magic of some sort but you wouldn't expect them to be for kids. And those films don't look cheap either.
Ideally, a future MK film should combine the mature tone of the games along with its fantasy aspects. There should be a balance between the two. Definitely there should be no repeat of the first two movies. The first two films are just sell-out shit feasts, they were just an excuse to make money out of a popular franchise. MK, the first movie was just a tenth rate Enter the Dragon clone with some magic shit thrown in while Annihilation is bad but its bad in a campy sort of way, therefore it's better than the first.
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sonicherosfan1
06/10/2010 01:08 PM (UTC)
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I don't care what anyone saids, that Baraka and Cage fight was bad ass.
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Chrome
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06/10/2010 01:12 PM (UTC)
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Iguana666 Wrote:
It got straight to video written all over it. Whatever happened to the oriental flavor of Reptile for example? He's supposed to be a ninja right? Here, he's just some maniacal psycho and Baraka, wtf? It definitely isn't MK but it kinda reminds me of the Saw series of torture films. My, this is really bad like coming home from school and stepping on a steaming mess of stinky guano on a very hot day, lol.
Whoever said fantasy elements are for kids and boring realism is for adults? (the pitch isn't even realistic, it's corny as fuck). Movies like "Conan the Barbarian", Brian Yuzna's "Faust" were all grounded on some fantasy and magic of some sort but you wouldn't expect them to be for kids. And those films don't look cheap either.


When was ever Reptile oriental? A white male in a green garb. OK, a ninja garb, but it still had alot more in common with american inja movies than with ninjas in general.

Problem is, yes, fantasy can be done in an adult and captivating way. Problem is, they tried it with MKDA, by MKD it has worn out it's welcome. MKA was the icing on the shitcake. MK vs DC is a superhero flick so it looked kinda ok, but it was downhill way before.

sonicherosfan1 Wrote:
I don't care what anyone saids, that Baraka and Cage fight was bad ass.


The problem isn't wether the fantasy elements are adult or not. Problem is, MK had been in a stylistical shithole for 8 years.

Truth.
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