Oh yeah. Well maybe the Lin Kuei teach their initiates their history? Also, it could be that he comes in soon after the end of MK9 as opposed to the 25 year mark? In any case, presumably if he had cryomancy powers, he'd learn about the brothers who had those powers before him and through the story of Bi Han, learn about the Shirai Ryu and Scorpion? The story of how the Shirai Ryu he killed came back from Hell to murder him would make an awesome campfire story

Could indicate part of the story is set far in past, or that the Shirai Ryu exists once more after MK9...

I think that any Lin Kuei would have plenty of reason for hating a Shirai Ryu and Scorpion specifically.

A) The Shirai Ryu are likely the Lin Kuei's oldest and bitterest rivals. Even if vanquished, new clan members would be well-versed in their clan's history with the Shirai. I'm sure the Lin Kuei's indoctrination goes deep.

B) At the time of this game, it would be silly to think that the Lin Kuei wouldn't know of Scorpion specifically, the wraith that unjustly murdered one of their highest ranked members (Bi-Han) and likely has stalked several other clan members due to his blind thirst for vengeance. I'm sure any clan member that encountered Scorpion, especially one given Sub-Zero Rank, would know exactly who Scorpion is.

Eh, I don't like the idea of Scorpion being a Lin Kuei boogeyman. I think people may be overestimating Kuai Liang's niceness. He is still a life long assassin after all. Something could've pissed him off somewhere between resurrection and where the story is.

Although this being a new Sub-Zero might be Boon's way of ensuring that they'll always be one around so his boner for him won't go down.

Well let's talk about that, how the Lin Kuei as a clan behaves in a post-MK9 continuity.

Why aren't they all robots ruled by Sektor? Why does the indoctrination of Bi-Han's era still exist exactly the same as it was pre-Cyber Initiative?

At the very least, if we know nothing else about THIS Sub-Zero, we now know that he is a loyal member of the clan, and thus the way he goes speaks to the way they all must be going.

Honestly, I think there's a serious discussion to be had about the possibility that this character comes from the PAST, not the future like Cassie.

Em Kombos are so awesome... em animations are smooth

I'm just wondering, after a good look, if that is the Lin Kuei medallion or just a symbol glowing because of the character variation.

If it is one of the brothers, it has to be Bi-Han. I would actually prefer this. Perhaps the Soulnado ripped the Noob right out of him? I doubt it (because of MKDA scorpion) but still. With the MKA ending, I can't help but wonder how they view the essence of Noob Saibot in relation to needing to be connected to Bi-Han. Because Bi-Han defeating Quan/Shinnok before, I could totally see Raiden asking the elder gods for Bi-Han back.

From the dialogue, I am actually going to go out on a limb here and say that the Shirai Ryu is now back. 25 years(potentially) is a long time. I have no idea how and by whom, with these timeline placements and the whole element of time travel within MK9.

A designer, in an interview, has said that Raiden's actions have continued to cause a rippling effect in the realms. Could we see some other changes? Could we see Elder Subzero (KL/BH's father) or Takeda? (I think that's the name).

I sure hope so. But as it stands, this subzero is not cyber which leads me to believe Sektor is dead/unplayable or has been defeated.

I really do hope we see the return of the Shirai Ryu. I KNOW so many people hate the concept of what Frost was and I agree that so many more interesting characters can be introduced.... but...

I want a female Shirai Ryu. I want one so god damn bad.

Anyways, predictions:
-Not Kuai Liang
-Shirai Ryu is back
-Sektor = toast

I would take that with a grain of salt. What I can understand of them, they're saying that it's probably an european thing that the fatality's aren't good. Being european myself, I say they should just speak for themselves.

I believe they are saying: The fatalities are not good for the European fans. They mean the game will be banned or toned down in Germany - again.
I kind of agree with them that the speed seems TOO fast in their video.

I would never rule out the possibility of a Sub-Zero from the past. And I agree, and have mentioned before, that this clear indoctrination is very indicative of the Lin Kuei's current thinking, if from the "present" time.

I really don't think this is a past Sub-Zero however, and I'll give my reasoning. Scorpion WAS killed by Bi-Han, yes? Therefor, the only Sub-Zero that could have encountered undead Scorpion would be Bi-Han and Kuai Liang, as of the new timeline. MK9 made it relatively clear that the first tournament was the first (and last) encounter between undead Scorpion and Bi-Han, so that rules out this being Bi-Han, barring NRS retconning their own story so soon after telling it.

I think we can agree that this is NOT Kuai Liang. I realize that he is (was?) a Lin Kuei, however his questioning of the Lin Kuei's Cyber program and dropping his Tundra title for Sub-Zero of his own accord (not the clan giving it to him) and his own (and Smoke's) pursuit of his brother's killer (It does't seem to be a mission given to him, as he and Smoke were to be kidnapped and forcefully brought back to base), all this evidences, to me, Kuai's tendency to think for himself outside of the Lin Kuei's indoctrination. It's not about him being a "good" guy. I just can't imagine him saying "Shirai Ryu dog."

So what I come away with is that the Lin Kuei, as of the start of MKX, have a new Grandmaster, possibly Sektor, possibly Kuai Liang, or someone new. This new Grandmaster has rejected, at least somewhat, the Cyber program and appointed a new Sub-Zero(s).

While all of this is speculation, it's safe to say that SOMETHING has dramatically changed with our friends at the Lin Kuei.

By "back" do you mean resurrected, or do you mean "Quan for some reason let Scorp leave Hell to start a new life and train new dudes"?

Because if Scorpion's clan came back from the dead, wouldn't they tell him that Sub-Zero didn't kill them, Quan Chi did? I mean, their ghosts do that very thing in Scorp's arcade ending, which I'm sure is noncanon, but still proves they KNOW who offed them.

And the second doesn't make much sense from a character behavior standpoint either.

Maybe I'm missing something, but how would this being a rezzed Bi-Han retcon anything? I mean, other than his apparent death in the soulnado, of course.

Oh, this could totally be a rezzed Bi-Han. I was just saying that it's unlikely that this is a past (Pre MK9) encounter.

Love the gameplay system, it's a lot more fluid and fast paced. And it's good to see actual long connected combos, especially D'Vorah's. I like the range on her stingers, can keep stringing combos together.

I don't mean the encounter happens in the past (the fight occurring in a specific time period wouldn't make much sense since this isn't a clip from story mode, it's what the characters say to each other every time they fight in arcade or vs), I mean the character is FROM the past like how Cassie is from the future.

So like Bi-Han or his father, either brought back from the dead or displaced in time.

Nah, more likely the Shirai Ryu is back in some form or another.

OR...its just random dialogue indicating nothing at all story-wise.

"as for what they are saying, I understand German, they are pretty negative about the game, basically saying its fighting system is not meant for high level play as it is too fast and similar to MK9 and Injustice, leaving little space for tactics and such. Also, they mention that the fatalities are disappointing."

Not disappointing. They said they are tacky/vulgar and only americans would looking forward to them. Well i'm german... and... they speak for themselves. Actually these were idiots if you ask me :) And it has some reason why they have so much negativ comments and dislikes.

To be honest I actually like this Steve Blum Sub-Zero. Fits his cold personality, but the plot continuity issues are apparent. I'm sure Boon will try to explain this one out.

That's also possible, but still unlikely, in my opinion. And I wouldn't say Cassie is from the future. I don't think she is displaced, just from the most future portion of the plot.

I still think most of the evidence points towards a new Sub-Zero(s), such as Ed's remarks. Also, I feel that the mask is significant. Both Bi-Han/Noob and Kuai Liang have had pretty character specific mask styles going back as far as Deception. This one is completely new.

And I'm very interested to see exactly what is going on with the Lin Kuei.

A lot of that would depend on the events following MK9's conclusion. There are way too many variables to even make a guess. After MK9's time-message, Raiden is aware of the deadly alliance, no? IF Shinnok is a threat and is dealt with, since Shang Tsung is dead, I assume Quan Chi becomes #1 on his list of "Not fucking happening". Lets say Raiden mercs him. Nobody is controlling Scorpion and we know he wants the Shirai Ryu to "walk the earth once more". Resurrected or newly formed are different but at this point, I don't think Scorpion would refuse either.

If Quan dies before this revelation is made, Scorpion may go on thinking it was Subzero. If Subzero is now Bi-Han or some pro-Kuei/anti-Shirai symbol, We could see the old feud revived. I don't think Raiden would interfere or reveal anything if two "evil" clans were wiping eachother off the map. So he wouldn't reveal the truth to Scorpion.

If Shinnok and Quan Chi fall quickly, this could happen VERY early in our twenty-five year window. plenty of time for a clan to be rebuilt. I mean, I am just picking at distant possibilities but I could see it happening. If I were to pick one of Scorpion's two options at that point, I can't really see him recruiting anybody. I'd expect that he would desire resurrection both for his family and original clan.

BUT

If that happened, the revelation would be made by them, as well. So who the hell knows?

Also, wouldn't Quan Chi have been able to keep Scorpion in hell before MKDA's happenings? I do believe he has a healthy portion of control but it is clear he can't just say "fuck off" and have him fuck off. Given MK4's transportation wasn't exactly planned on Quan's part.

Like I said. Just theorizing.

wait, getting confused...so why isn't this SZ simply Kuai Liang?

He's the younger brother, right?...
he didn't die...
yes, I'm choosing to ignore cyber sz (lol)...

I think it's alot more likely that from MK9's perspective, they simply "un-robotosize" the future Lin Kuei Master and move forward from there.

Sindel killed him...

The canon's not clear on it thanks to repeated retcons to the nature of Scorp and Quan's relationship...

...but in most of the games, Scorpion can't leave Hell at will, he has to be let out.

MKDA is the big difference, it has him die in Outworld like two or three times and just keep teleporting right back, but there are multiple ways to handwave it, like he had gotten a power boost and Quan had been drained.

This very much does seem like Bi-Han. Combine that with the earlier mention of him being fed up of trying to maintain innocence and I'm leaning even more strongly toward Noob Saibot being undone or being split off from Bi-Han as a seperate identity. Scar_Subby's going to lose his shit.

hm...