Maybe I miss-used the word "balanced", I didn't mean it in as in tiers (don't care about that). Just that some of the characters got really uninspired or almost a "one move change" for a variation. Like they couldn't come up with anything for that character and just half-assed something there because everyone HAD to have 3 variations.

So I got bored and watched the trailer again a few more times....did anyone else notice how odd Alien's tail looks? A lot of the time, it looks like the middle portion of it is constantly being held upright by a wire or something. Once I noticed it, I couldn't unnotice it.

Yep, I noticed that too.

Yeah I noticed the tail too.

I guess time will tell if it will always have a hard on during fights or not.

Don't get me wrong. I love the variation system. Some variations I use like Unbreakable, Piercing and Lasher probably wouldn't exist without the system so it's a plus. I was only saying the one thing I don't like about the variation system.

People brought up Tanya. I love what they did with the Naginata but I would have been more than happy to see Tanya with a few fireball and kobutsu moves.

I'm also worried about the new characters if they decide to go back to a universal moveset. The old characters gave us new ways to play with them but we wouldn't be out of our element if they went back to their old moveset.

But how do you scale back Takeda? Erron Black? Kotal Kahn? How do you go back to a single moveset without alienating the people who used the different variations?

Anyway, I'm fine with that Pit. It could have been modified more but it's the greatest Pit in MK history so it's awesome. But seeing the cyborgs and the Pit in the MKX universe is weird. It shows how different MK9 and MKX are in term of look and atmosphere.

I actually agree with this. I don't know what it is but they just stand out to me.

It seems that way until you realise that some of the tools given that variation are extremely powerful. For example in Grandmaster, Sub-Zero gains the ice-clone and that is it. This is an extremely good move so any more moves would make him cheap. If you do not care about gameplay balance then you do not have any business talking about the anaemia of variations. Some variations have more moves or less moves depending on the strength of the tools that variation is given. That is it.



How?! You can not use all three variations in a match, you can only use one. So a character only needs one viable variation to be used at higher level play so there is triple the chance of the character being viable compared to one chance without variations like with MK9.

I do believe the concept is not difficult to understand. I can not explain it in simpler terms.

Okay. So going off of your words, a character can have one 'viable' variation and thats fine? You said the variation system is a way to give each character three chances to be viable though.

You also said some low tier characters will always get the short end of the stick, which is why they are low tier.....

Anyway, whatever you're describing sounds a lot like balancing, and that's not the point.

Jesus Christ.

Yeah, one is fine because last time I checked it is better than nought. There is a reason why no one used characters like Jade or Sheeva at high level play in MK9. Both of them sucked. They were not viable. With a variation system they would get three chances to become viable.

A tier list is where characters are listed by chances to win. This is a game with limited variables. Some characters are obviously going to be better than others but as long as lower tier characters are viable it is fine. This is basic.

Of course it is about balance. This is a fighting game believe it or not. Hence the reason why character balance is fundemental and that is why they patch the game with character balance patches.

The variation system was implemented in order to change the strategy of a certain character, without changing his/her basic moveset.
So, every character could be a rushdown/pressure, a zoner or defensive.
All the variation follow this basic formula.

Defensive: unbreakable, fisticuffs, brawler, demolition, sorcerer, impostor, royal storm, ethereal, blood god, venomous, deceptive, and so on

Pressure: cryomancer, a-list, hollywood, covert ops, warlock, bome shaper, assassin, piercer, war god, swarm queen, nimble, and so on

Zoning: grand master, stunt double, spec ops, summoner, necromancer, mournful, ravenous, sun god, and so on.

Of course there are exceptions, like Scorpion, Jax amd Liu Kang.



In this way every player can play his favourite character fitting his own play-style, and not viceversa.

Even with the more uninspired variations, like let's say Mileena's Ethereal variation. She still has all of her old move set there. Some variations aren't as good as others, that's balance. But, The argument that the characters aren't "full" with the variation system isn't true.

As for the "I'd rather have more characters" argument. It wasn't a trade off. With all dlc said and done, only Armageddon has more playable characters.

They're the only vibrant and outrageous characters in this game. Everyone else has a toned down "grounded" design and the entire game has a desaturated pallet. Even characters with color within their design have most of the vibrancy taken out of them.

Yeah, makes sense. lol

Its sad. MKX' realistic turn is probably one of my few problems with the game overall.

People don't seem to understand that you don't need variations to have a character be 'defensive', 'zoning' or whatever category you make up. You can have all in one!

The realism is bittersweet for me.

The gritty realism was one of the top aspects of the game I was looking forward to. It was exciting to know designs and concepts would be taken more seriously this time.

However, the muted palette (mainly referring to stages here) was a bit disappointing. Aside from The Kove, Jinsei Chamber, and perhaps The Krossroads. Just a few added purple tints and hues to the Marketplace would have made that stage.

As for character designs, I still think this is the absolute best most of the characters have EVER looked. Quan Chi, Kitana, Mileena, Shinnok, Goro, and Raiden to name a few. So even if a few designs aren't flamboyantly colorful, it's hard for me personally to complain about them since I like just about all of the designs in this game.

Colors. They have colors compared to everything else in the game.


@xysion
I don't care about tier stuff when I choose my character. I never said I'm the most strategic player...If I like a character and their moves, I'm gonna choose it. And if I feel like some variations were done better than others (from my nonstrategic point of view) I'm gonna say it.

LOL Holy fuck, that gif made my day.

If you are going to say it and then admit you do not how the implementation works out then expect to get called out. We could be here all day about how certain variations were done better than others because of opinions and it is a worthless conversation that has no merit at all. In fact that kind of asinine thinking can be applied to every aspect of the game.



So that every character ends up playing the same way with nearly all the same tools?

I wonder how many fighting games do this? Oh yeah, none. Zero. Zilch. Nada. Nought.

You guys do realise this is a fighting game, right? The fighting is the most important part? That is what you are going to be doing most of the time? So brush up on fighting game fundementals and then talk about it.

Mhm, so your examples, Sheeva and Jade, if they came to MKX and had three variations, but still were not 'viable' (as we have seen with several MKX characters) what difference does it make?
Is every character in MKX 'viable' now? You said some characters always get the short end of the stick, so I can't understand what you're saying. Is that you agreeing with me?
With what you are describing every character should work, and there should be no such thing as low tier, because everyone can work.
It's not just about the fighting believe it or not, the characters should get about the same amount of creativity and effort. Its obvious that some did not. If it was just about fighting, there wouldn't be a story mode.

Well said, weeeelll saaiiiid!

You are talking about a hypothetical situation. The point was that having three chances to become viable is better than one. It is not really difficult to comprehend I do believe. Sheeva and Jade are totally unviable. They are extremely weak compared to Kung Lao or Kabal. If Kabal was SS rank then Sheeva and Jade would be E rank. The tier list in MKX is much closer because of the variation system. Anyone who has played both games with a modicum of fighting game fundementals would realise this.



They are much more viable than before as explained previous. I have already explained this. In a fighting game no two characters can be equal. Some will always be better than others but if the lower tier characters can keep up with higher tier characters then they are viable. I have already explained this in this very thread. Do you even know what viable in fighting game setting even means. WTF? Stop wasting my time and making me repeat things.




It is obvious in your opinion they did not. Since your opinion is based on a lack of fighting game knowledge, your opinion on whether the variations are more robust than others is moot.

I'm speaking to a god amongst men, so I'll come correctly.

You brought up MK9 so as a point of reference, I referred to what you brought up. Hypothetical as it may be, the point is still relevant. What difference would a Sheeva with three variations make? Three attempts to become 'viable' does not guarantee that Sheeva will be a top tier, or even a more competitive character. The point of the conversation was that variations if not done well, does not serve the characters any better.

If lower tier characters could regularly keep up with higher tier characters, then there would be no lower tier.

I'm not even arguing with you though, your ego has you offended about something.

Goodnight.

You are wasting my time because:

i) you can not comprehend simple English
ii) you know nothing about fighting games fundementals

You do not even understand the basics.



This proves yet again you do not understand how a tier list works even though it is so simple. Tell you what. Go and write that on a competitive fighting game forum and see what happens and what kind of replies you get. Go and ask them what "viable" in a fighting game means. Ask them how the variation system works in a fighting game setting.

No thanks, I'm done with you.
Continue to waste your own time, wise one.