My first thought and most lasting impression when I heard of the reveal was, "Aw, goddammit... the Khronic Komplainers are going to have a grand old time with this one."
As much as I'm curious what role he's going to play, what side he chooses, how his gameplay and fighting style has developed and so on... it's hard to escape the sense that the backlash against the series' original main characters (the ones who gave players their first impression of "Who is Mortal Kombat?") seems to overshadow the characters themselves.
Luckily it's only certain segments of the audience, and Kano has enough fans to make him feel at least somewhat welcome in a world that he helped set the tone for way back in the beginning.
I personally do not believe that because Kano is an original character from MK1 that he should get some kind of preferential treatment or put on a pedastal. A character should be judged on their merits.
[....]
A break would do him good and I am sure he would get a better reaction if he missed the next game and returned in the after that one.
It's not about putting anybody on a pedestal. It's about recognizing that he's a long lived and influential character with a good number of fans, so even though he doesn't excite you personally, having him back is not necessarily a problem. Certainly not a problem worth people getting angry about.
As for me, I'm not all that excited for Kano either. But that has more to do with him not being one of my top favorite characters. Now, I was excited to see Kabal back, because he is one of my all time favorites and I would be happy to see him back for every single game. I don't think his missing a game really moved my needle.
On that note, supposing he did skip a game and come back for the next one. Are you... sure he would get a better reaction the next time around? Because I've already seen complaints about Kabal and Baraka coming back just because they're from the Trilogy era.
Now, if we're judging characters by their merits then I have to ask: What exactly did characters like Fujin and Reiko do to "merit" the amount of fan swoon they seem to get? Maybe if Fujin actually did become Earth's protector for Deadly Alliance we'd be getting somewhere. Maybe if Reiko had any kind of story or personality besides "mystery guy does mystery things because we can't let the time we spent on this unused Johnny Cage model go to waste." Meanwhile, Kano went from thug on the run to traitorous Outworld arms dealer to a General in Shao Kahn's army, then profiteered off both sides of a civil war in the new timeline, making a notable impact in each individual appearance. If we're talking about merits, then he's earned his place in every game he's been in.
I'm not saying the other guys shouldn't make a comeback. They have potential. My point is that I don't think anyone "shouldn't" make a comeback, originals included.
This
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Both Reiko and Fujin don't have 10% of what Kano has in design, personality and overall importance to the story. Both were semi reject.
That's fine and all, but you're acting as if all those years of whiny, loud people on the internet asking for Tremor, Tanya, Shinnok, Quan Chi, etc had any impact the time it came to play those characters. You're bringing the "character usage" thing, and nobody played those characters. Do you really think Fujin, Reiko, etc would be any more popular?
Besides, Erron Black and Reptile were the least used base characters, not Kano.
No, they were not:
Show me where Erron Black or Reptile were the least played. I played a lot online and I would meet Erron Black frequently. Reptile not so much but Kano? Hardly ever.
Tremor and Tanya were DLC and were released later. That is obviously going to affect their usage. I was talking characters that every person had access to on the main roster not DLC. Kano was the least played.
Never shake hands with a man who wears his heart on his sleeve.
Now, if we're judging characters by their merits then I have to ask: What exactly did characters like Fujin and Reiko do to "merit" the amount of fan swoon they seem to get? Maybe if Fujin actually did become Earth's protector for Deadly Alliance we'd be getting somewhere. Maybe if Reiko had any kind of story or personality besides "mystery guy does mystery things because we can't let the time we spent on this unused Johnny Cage model go to waste." Meanwhile, Kano went from thug on the run to traitorous Outworld arms dealer to a General in Shao Kahn's army, then profiteered off both sides of a civil war in the new timeline, making a notable impact in each individual appearance. If we're talking about merits, then he's earned his place in every game he's been in.
I'm not saying the other guys shouldn't make a comeback. They have potential. My point is that I don't think anyone "shouldn't" make a comeback, originals included.
That he is a long lived character means little. I do not think he is influential at all. The biggest development Kano ever got was becoming Australian. He has done nothing story wise and is never crucial to the plot of the series. He has got fans but not that many. He was the least played base character in MKX. Even much maligned characters series newcomers like Ferra/Torr and Jacqui were played more than Kano. That is telling.
I am 100% sure that he would get a better reaction if he missed a game and returned in the next one. Looking at the reaction for Baraka and Skarlet proves exactly that point. People get apathetic seeing the same thing over and over again especially when they have characters they want returning. People have not played Fujin in a long time. The longer they wait the more they want to revisit him. People want to play Fujin for their own reasons, I can not speak for everyone. Personally I do not care about Fujin but I do recognise that a lot of people want to play him for their own reasons.
I agree no character should not comback but that does not mean everyone is going to be happy to see them when they are makng a comeback. It does not work that way and fatigue is an issue.
Idunno mate. You opened up this conversation by saying, "A character should be judged on their merits," then when I listed off the plot points that made him influential to each game he's been in, you dismissed those out of hand (he has done nothing storywise... if you choose to ignore the parts where he was first Sonya's sole driving motivation, gave Kahn weapons to invade Earth, saved Kahn from being assassinated and led his army against Kitana's resistance) and moved the goalposts to "crucial."
If "crucial" is the standard now, and we set the bar so that Kano's importance doesn't meet the requirements, then almost nobody is crucial except Liu Kang and Raiden, Shang Tsung, Sindel, Quan Chi, Shujinko, Taven/Daegon, and the boss of each game. Everyone else is either a supporting character, or a sideshow with nothing to do with the main event.
Character usage stats are relevant only if you're asking the question, "How often is the character used?" Which could be influenced by people's perception of his gameplay, which is separate from his overall fandom. There's a reason why character usage fluctuates wildly over time. "Fans" can be made or lost on the day-to-day whims of the most active online players and the followers they influence. Not the best metric for this topic, I think.
Skarlet and Baraka got a bigger reaction at the event, probably because they came as a surprise. I'll grant that. Yet that only means they got a bigger reaction due to the surprise, not that the ones who got a smaller reaction from a significant body of still-enthusiastic fans are useless or undeserving of a roster slot. It says nothing about how excited fans will continue to be once the surprise wears off. And even if a full 50% of the cast turns out to be a surprise returning character, the other 50% of the cast are still going to be classics who got shat on or meh'd at when they were announced. And that's hardly healthy or fair to those characters.
Fatigue is indeed an issue or we wouldn't be talking about it. But as @thisiscourage noted above, it's mostly the vocally disappointed people who are talking about it. How pervasive is the fatigue really, when MKX disclosed their entire roster ahead of time and still outsold everything?
That's fine and all, but you're acting as if all those years of whiny, loud people on the internet asking for Tremor, Tanya, Shinnok, Quan Chi, etc had any impact the time it came to play those characters. You're bringing the "character usage" thing, and nobody played those characters. Do you really think Fujin, Reiko, etc would be any more popular?
Besides, Erron Black and Reptile were the least used base characters, not Kano.
No, they were not:
Show me where Erron Black or Reptile were the least played. I played a lot online and I would meet Erron Black frequently. Reptile not so much but Kano? Hardly ever.
Tremor and Tanya were DLC and were released later. That is obviously going to affect their usage. I was talking characters that every person had access to on the main roster not DLC. Kano was the least played.
Yes they were. The list you posted is super outdated and didn't even include the DLC characters:
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/253573-mortal-kombat-11/77305186
That's a more recent one, after the Kombat Pack 1 was out and Kano was used more than Ferra/Torr, Quan Chi, Erron Black, and Reptile, all which were playable at launch. Your personal experience on who you faced more doesn't matter.
That's fine and all, but you're acting as if all those years of whiny, loud people on the internet asking for Tremor, Tanya, Shinnok, Quan Chi, etc had any impact the time it came to play those characters. You're bringing the "character usage" thing, and nobody played those characters. Do you really think Fujin, Reiko, etc would be any more popular?
Besides, Erron Black and Reptile were the least used base characters, not Kano.
No, they were not:
Show me where Erron Black or Reptile were the least played. I played a lot online and I would meet Erron Black frequently. Reptile not so much but Kano? Hardly ever.
Tremor and Tanya were DLC and were released later. That is obviously going to affect their usage. I was talking characters that every person had access to on the main roster not DLC. Kano was the least played.
Yes they were. The list you posted is super outdated and didn't even include the DLC characters:
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/253573-mortal-kombat-11/77305186
That's a more recent one, after the Kombat Pack 1 was out and Kano was used more than Ferra/Torr, Quan Chi, Erron Black, and Reptile, all which were playable at launch. Your personal experience on who you faced more doesn't matter.
No they were not. That list you posted is clearly wrong. How can Erron black have HALF the usage of my list? That clearly makes no sense whatsoever. That list you posted does not corrobarate with any other other lists from other forums as well.
Anyone with any experience playing the game knows that Erron Black was one of the most popular characters in the game. The list you posted is clearly wrong. Even a cursory check would affirm so.
Never shake hands with a man who wears his heart on his sleeve.
The fact that there are so many versions of usage lists, alone, makes it pretty unreliable for figuring out a character's popularity. Even assuming that it's relevant, which I argue it isn't, because again, it's always in flux and doesn't reflect the characters' fanbases (only their usage).
I have always loved Reptile in all his incarnations. I hardly play him because his gameplay involves a lot of trickery that my clumsy ass thumbs can't take full advantage of. I don't care about Liu Kang or Leatherface, but I can count on them for wins. Fandom and usage are different things.
Ah man I was really hoping for Jarek. He never got his revenge against Jax's police brutality (MK4).
Shao Kahn did nothing wrong
The fact that there are so many versions of usage lists, alone, makes it pretty unreliable for figuring out a character's popularity. Even assuming that it's relevant, which I argue it isn't, because again, it's always in flux and doesn't reflect the characters' fanbases (only their usage).
I have always loved Reptile in all his incarnations. I hardly play him because his gameplay involves a lot of trickery that my clumsy ass thumbs can't take full advantage of. I don't care about Liu Kang or Leatherface, but I can count on them for wins. Fandom and usage are different things.
Agreed. Just because they're not used doesn't mean there's no fanbase for the character. That's a terrible argument. People have to factor in the gameplay that changes for these characters between games sometimes changes for better or for worse. Example for me is I loved how Kano played in MK9. He's in my top favorites as well but when it came to MKX his gameplay didn't feel the same to me. While I still played as him I didn't play as him nearly enough as I picked him up in 9. Doesn't make me less of a fan of him.
The fact that there are so many versions of usage lists, alone, makes it pretty unreliable for figuring out a character's popularity. Even assuming that it's relevant, which I argue it isn't, because again, it's always in flux and doesn't reflect the characters' fanbases (only their usage).
I have always loved Reptile in all his incarnations. I hardly play him because his gameplay involves a lot of trickery that my clumsy ass thumbs can't take full advantage of. I don't care about Liu Kang or Leatherface, but I can count on them for wins. Fandom and usage are different things.
There are not many versions. That list from diirecthit is clearly wrong. For example, Kenshi is is too low as well.
However, one thing consistent on any character usage list is that Kano is always near the bottom. He was near bottom for the MK9 character usage list as well. I think that along with the fact there has been so much negative reaction to Kano's inclusion on forums, social channels and on Reddit is conclusive enough eveidence that Kano is not really popular.
Like it or not people tend to play with their favourites. Is it a coincidence that Scorpion and Sub-Zero were the two highest placed characters in usage for MK9 and MKX? No. They are the most popular characters in MK and that reflects in the character usage. People in most cases want to play as their favourite. Clearly, there is a correlation with how popular a character is with their character usage.
Never shake hands with a man who wears his heart on his sleeve.
There are not many versions. That list from diirecthit is clearly wrong. For example, Kenshi is is too low as well.
However, one thing consistent on any character usage list is that Kano is always near the bottom. He was near bottom for the MK9 character usage list as well. I think that along with the fact there has been so much negative reaction to Kano's inclusion on forums, social channels and on Reddit is conclusive enough eveidence that Kano is not really popular.
Like it or not people tend to play with their favourites. Is it a coincidence that Scorpion and Sub-Zero were the two highest placed characters in usage for MK9 and MKX? No. They are the most popular characters in MK and that reflects in the character usage. People in most cases want to play as their favourite. Clearly, there is a correlation with how popular a character is with their character usage.
... I hate to keep running your points into the ground like this, but did you notice that your own source acknowledges that the stats change over time as players come and go, stats get reset after an update -- you know, "versions." Did you read the post or just the numbers?
Takeda and Cassie look awfully popular for how much fan hate there is on the social channels for all things Kombat Kid. Mileena doesn't look so hot in MK9 and lots of people seem to like her. We can cherrypick all kinds of misleading conclusions about fan appeal from the usage stats.
Don't mind Directhitt, he is still the same troll he always was before, he only cares for the human characters (Cassie, SOnya, Jax, Kano, Jacqui and Johnny)
So that list is more to his liking where Erron Black and Reptile have the least usages.
Never shake hands with a man who wears his heart on his sleeve.
Well at this point looks like there are way people showing enthusiastic support for Kano as there are enthusiastic detractors, with more noncommittal but vaguely supportive commenters than negative ones as well.
So Kano's fine, I guess. Doesn't seem to need my help to make his case. My investment in this thread is waning anyway, so have fun everybody.
The fact that there are so many versions of usage lists, alone, makes it pretty unreliable for figuring out a character's popularity. Even assuming that it's relevant, which I argue it isn't, because again, it's always in flux and doesn't reflect the characters' fanbases (only their usage).
I have always loved Reptile in all his incarnations. I hardly play him because his gameplay involves a lot of trickery that my clumsy ass thumbs can't take full advantage of. I don't care about Liu Kang or Leatherface, but I can count on them for wins. Fandom and usage are different things.
Agreed. Just because they're not used doesn't mean there's no fanbase for the character. That's a terrible argument. People have to factor in the gameplay that changes for these characters between games sometimes changes for better or for worse. Example for me is I loved how Kano played in MK9. He's in my top favorites as well but when it came to MKX his gameplay didn't feel the same to me. While I still played as him I didn't play as him nearly enough as I picked him up in 9. Doesn't make me less of a fan of him.
Oh so much this.
To all people complaining about Kano not having a story or a role in the plot....
Plrase, make up better excuses.
Kano's Mk Da konquest mode is more than anything Reiko and Fujin have ever achieved in the whole franchise
Kano, actually, is one of the most plot relevant characters ever in the franchise
Mk1 = vital role main reason Sonya joins the tournament
Mk3= he switches sides and teaches Shao Kahn's army how to use earth's weapons; he fights Sonya, indirectly causes the death of both Sheeva and Motaro, becomes General of outworld armies.
Mk DA: is feud with the red dragon is introduced, is the main reason why Li Mei joins the tournament
Armageddon= subject of experiments from red dragon clan, interacts with Taven has his own agenda in the final act of the story.
Mk9= tries to sell weapons to Shang Tsung, saves Kabal from certain death, warns Noob of Cyber Subby betrayal
Mkx=pivotal role in stealing and getting back Shinnok's amulet, makes arrangements with both parties during the Civil war, gives Kuai Liang his iconic scar, decimates Oni and Shokans armies,
Please tell me what the hell did Reiko do in the story...
To all people complaining about Kano not having a story or a role in the plot....
Plrase, make up better excuses.
Kano's Mk Da konquest mode is more than anything Reiko and Fujin have ever achieved in the whole franchise
Kano, actually, is one of the most plot relevant characters ever in the franchise
Mk1 = vital role main reason Sonya joins the tournament
Mk3= he switches sides and teaches Shao Kahn's army how to use earth's weapons; he fights Sonya, indirectly causes the death of both Sheeva and Motaro, becomes General of outworld armies.
Mk DA: is feud with the red dragon is introduced, is the main reason why Li Mei joins the tournament
Armageddon= subject of experiments from red dragon clan, interacts with Taven has his own agenda in the final act of the story.
Mk9= tries to sell weapons to Shang Tsung, saves Kabal from certain death, warns Noob of Cyber Subby betrayal
Mkx=pivotal role in stealing and getting back Shinnok's amulet, makes arrangements with both parties during the Civil war, gives Kuai Liang his iconic scar, decimates Oni and Shokans armies,
Please tell me what the hell did Reiko do in the story...
"Even in the face of overwhelming odds, Kano stood ground and eventually managed to repel Princess Kitana and her Edenian-Shokan army. "
He died once and that's in Armageddon. He always survives. He has the least super natural powers.
I'd take him over Fujin and Reiko anytime. If anything, there are better 3D characters than Reiko and Fujin.
"You Totally Slept With Him Didn't Ya"
To all people complaining about Kano not having a story or a role in the plot....
Plrase, make up better excuses.
Kano's Mk Da konquest mode is more than anything Reiko and Fujin have ever achieved in the whole franchise
Kano, actually, is one of the most plot relevant characters ever in the franchise
Mk1 = vital role main reason Sonya joins the tournament
Mk3= he switches sides and teaches Shao Kahn's army how to use earth's weapons; he fights Sonya, indirectly causes the death of both Sheeva and Motaro, becomes General of outworld armies.
Mk DA: is feud with the red dragon is introduced, is the main reason why Li Mei joins the tournament
Armageddon= subject of experiments from red dragon clan, interacts with Taven has his own agenda in the final act of the story.
Mk9= tries to sell weapons to Shang Tsung, saves Kabal from certain death, warns Noob of Cyber Subby betrayal
Mkx=pivotal role in stealing and getting back Shinnok's amulet, makes arrangements with both parties during the Civil war, gives Kuai Liang his iconic scar, decimates Oni and Shokans armies,
Please tell me what the hell did Reiko do in the story...
"Even in the face of overwhelming odds, Kano stood ground and eventually managed to repel Princess Kitana and her Edenian-Shokan army. "
He died once and that's in Armageddon. He always survives. He has the least super natural powers.
I'd take him over Fujin and Reiko anytime. If anything, there are better 3D characters than Reiko and Fujin.
be careful people will attack you for saying that (not me)
I'd rather have all 3 of them
Don't mind Directhitt, he is still the same troll he always was before, he only cares for the human characters (Cassie, SOnya, Jax, Kano, Jacqui and Johnny)
So that list is more to his liking where Erron Black and Reptile have the least usages.
Calling anyone a troll is rich coming from you, how long will your new account last before you get banned again?
Besides, the list posted by that one member would be more of my liking as it has all 3 of my favorite characters in the top 10. At least try to make sense, lmao. But anyway, yeah, I really like the human characters and I'm glad most of them keep making it into these games, they're really popular, central to the story, and all around cool and stron in-game. Will 100% take them over the jobbers ya'll keep asking for.
... I hate to keep running your points into the ground like this, but did you notice that your own source acknowledges that the stats change over time as players come and go, stats get reset after an update -- you know, "versions." Did you read the post or just the numbers?
Takeda and Cassie look awfully popular for how much fan hate there is on the social channels for all things Kombat Kid. Mileena doesn't look so hot in MK9 and lots of people seem to like her. We can cherrypick all kinds of misleading conclusions about fan appeal from the usage stats.
Stats can change but my post in my link was taken after a year of the release of the game. The chances of characters moving drastically is practically nil since the player base would have diminished significantly after year from the launch of the game. Even if Kano was not bottom like I said and we take Diirecthit list instead, Kano is in the bottom 5 of the base characters usage. Kano always been near the bottom in character usage in MKX. Whether you want to believe that or not is up to you but it is a fact.
Kano has never been used highly in MK9 or MKX at any stage. I do not see how anyone can cherrypick anything when Kano near the bottom for two games straight in character usage and the reaction to his inclusion in MK11 has been largely negative? I mean if you want to continue to believe that Kano is popular or whatever despite character usage to the contrary and people's negative reaction to his inclusion then more power to you.
... I hate to keep running your points into the ground like this, but did you notice that your own source acknowledges that the stats change over time as players come and go, stats get reset after an update -- you know, "versions." Did you read the post or just the numbers?
Takeda and Cassie look awfully popular for how much fan hate there is on the social channels for all things Kombat Kid. Mileena doesn't look so hot in MK9 and lots of people seem to like her. We can cherrypick all kinds of misleading conclusions about fan appeal from the usage stats.
Stats can change but my post in my link was taken after a year of the release of the game. The chances of characters moving drastically is practically nil since the player base would have diminished significantly after year from the launch of the game. Even if Kano was not bottom like I said and we take Diirecthit list instead, Kano is in the bottom 5 of the base characters usage. Kano always been near the bottom in character usage in MKX. Whether you want to believe that or not is up to you but it is a fact.
Kano has never been used highly in MK9 or MKX at any stage. I do not see how anyone can cherrypick anything when Kano near the bottom for two games straight in character usage and the reaction to his inclusion in MK11 has been largely negative? I mean if you want to continue to believe that Kano is popular or whatever despite character usage to the contrary and people's negative reaction to his inclusion then more power to you.
Stats won't change need yeah he has been on the lower rank. People booed his MKDC reveal and yet he has been a staple ever since.
He is a NRS' favorite.
I won't deny the negative reaction some fans are throwing on him but there is a positive one too.
Kano made it to MK11. And will probably make it to 12.
There you go, finding a hidden advantage in an unfortunate circumstance; using pain to take you to the next level. Those are the things that turn players into kings.
id honestly take a brand new charachter over kano. not that i dont like him but if this is truly the next generation in the mk story i just think new generation of charachters should be created with very little klassic charachters . im a story guy and i prefer consistency
For the most in-depth, in-detail, Mortal Kombat lore analysis vids, there's only one source:
I agree; as much as I am a fan of Kano, they were strongly hinting that his son would be making an appearance and it's a bit of a letdown if we don't actually see him.
"You Totally Slept With Him Didn't Ya"
I agree; as much as I am a fan of Kano, they were strongly hinting that his son would be making an appearance and it's a bit of a letdown if we don't actually see him.
you'll have to see what is happening, but don't let it let you down so much it's just a game afterall
For the sake of throwing in 2 cents, I ABSOLUTELY think the years of whiny, loud people on the internet asking for Tremor are the reason he eventually became playable. If no one had said 2 words about him after Special Forces, we never would have seen him again. (See: No-Face & Tasia)
