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nitekin
03/29/2005 12:36 PM (UTC)
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good job i think the tier list is almost perfect
but i disagree with a few points
i would rather say
5.darrius
6.scorpion
7.shujinko
8.liu kang

darrius can be played badass
50/50 game:
throw ---> glitch
3 --> d,f+3 ---> sidestep throw ---> glitch...
if his first 3 glitches are breaked, u will still make a lot of dam 30% or something, although u have to achieve a new 50/50 game, but i think it is still better (sometimes it's better to make big combos than using always 50/50, i know that cuz i am a shujinko player, moreover it is more fun ^^)

and shujinko>liu kang maybe..
i think the possibility to do something after a throw (and this is very useful for big combo characters like shujinko) makes him better than liu kang
liu kang isn't the only one with fast attacks
shujinko got d+1 and 4
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Versatile
03/29/2005 11:17 PM (UTC)
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Bizatch Wrote:

Kori: b+2,1,2,1,2,4,cs,2,cs is better than the the same juggle off shoto b+2 because Kori: b+2 hits mid and can actually be set up. b+2 in shoto has absolutely no set up possibilities because it hits high and is unsafe. Dragon sucks..period. d+1 is ok but shotokan: d+1 is much better. All the pop ups in dragon have absolutely no set up or mix up value at all since they all start with high attacks. The only move I use out of dragon is 4,b+2 and that's only when I know they will not duck.

If your opponent starts to duck, why not just ff4 or uppercut them? free 50/50 afterwards, if they refuse to block standing, punish them. I mean Liu Kang has a lot of high hitting combo starters, and he's considered to be upper-mid tier.

Also, what's wrong with staying in the same stance the entire fight? Lots of characters do it. If you do (3rd stance) B+2, cs, 12, 124cs2cs....you'll end up right back in 3rd stance. Maybe some stances are meant purposely for juggle damage, and that's why Shotokan and Dragon stance have mostly high hits.


f,f+4? Is that even a move? Do you mean the cold shoulder(b,f+4)? If so, then it isn't that good of a move. It's only good if you have completely trained them to duck d+1 in shotokan and you don't feel like switching to Kori for b+2. Who knows if your theory about Shotokan and Dragon being made solely for juggle is true, but if is then Ed Boon has dissapointed me yet again.
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_Yoda_
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03/30/2005 07:41 PM (UTC)
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i'm still trying to get kabal into the top 10.....lol

after our last 4 games the other night konqrr...u saw that he now has a high/low attack along with his punishing spin. smile
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Konqrr
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MKII is a Glorified RPG...Turn Based Chip Damage!
03/30/2005 09:18 PM (UTC)
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Ya Yoda, that's good stuff. I'll have those matches where you totally owned me up on my site soon.

I don't know why I get hit with so many spins, it's crazy. Behold the best Kabal player...Yoda.
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Private_Joker
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Kaillera: Private J0k3r

03/30/2005 11:22 PM (UTC)
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How come Mileena moved up so much in the tier list? From personal experience it doesn't seem to me like she has very many tools to match up to the higher characters. Can someone tell me why shes good?
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Check
03/30/2005 11:42 PM (UTC)
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i wonder if its that low shit she got like sindel, i cant break out of that unless i jump over them..
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_Yoda_
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03/30/2005 11:50 PM (UTC)
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im glad u like it konqrr.....and i appreciate those mad props.....since you recorded....feel free to analize those fights. ppl still cant believe that he is that fast.....if played properly...u see what he can do....and i haven't even mastered him yet......notice that i am only using the 1st and 3rd stances only. I look foward to seeing them on your sight konqrr....that'll be kewl !!!!!!!

thnx.
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Konqrr
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MKII is a Glorified RPG...Turn Based Chip Damage!
03/31/2005 03:20 AM (UTC)
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Matches are up here.
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m2dave
03/31/2005 04:03 AM (UTC)
0
darrius can be played badass
50/50 game:
throw ---> glitch
3 --> d,f+3 ---> sidestep throw ---> glitch...
if his first 3 glitches are breaked, u will still make a lot of dam 30% or something, although u have to achieve a new 50/50 game, but i think it is still better (sometimes it's better to make big combos than using always 50/50, i know that cuz i am a shujinko player, moreover it is more fun ^^)


I believe the tier list is not based on that side step into throw glitch.Dairou has the same shit actually.After TS Drop, 1,1,f+3, change to first stance and walk up to a guaranteed throw.

Anyway,with Dairou I've been landing this combo online lately:

Fireball (from full screen), TS Drop, 1,1,f+3

Funny how sometimes you get a free TS Drop when the Fireball connects...lol.

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Omega Supreme
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There are three rules for doing scientific research. Unfortunately, no one knows what they are.

03/31/2005 10:03 AM (UTC)
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Yoda, it's good to see the Kabal love spread around :). It reminds me of how underrated Mavado used to be in DA but steadily climbed the t list.

My Kabal is not unlike yours, only I use goju ryu much more than sun bin because goju ryu has more mids and its moves are more powerful. Yes, the spin dash is a terrible weapon, I've destroyed many a player with it. The only thing that keeps bothering me is getting the timing right for his big hookswords combo, in many cases it fails - but even if it does, you still get about 35% out of it which is ok. ;)

Also, in another thread it was said that after hookswords 4 a throw is guaranteed... but this is not *always* true. Very rarely they can duck for it.

Cheers,
VQ

PS: By the way Yoda can Konqrr really analise your videos, or do you want him to analyse them? wink
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Chrome
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03/31/2005 04:23 PM (UTC)
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Just for comparison, can anyone of you guys make a list of MKDA and MKD? lets compare the two. I don't think Sub-Zero sucked that uch back in MKDA.
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_Yoda_
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04/01/2005 12:49 AM (UTC)
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vainqueur.....thnx for your comments.....yea its hard to pull off the full hooksword combo especially there at the edge....as the vids show....sadly, in none of those vids do they show me performing the whole combo.....believe me i can...lol.............that combo takes very good timing and believe it or not...a good connection....lag will kill that combo.

i started using sin bin cuz it was easier....my next step is to learn the 2nd stance cuz of the mid attacks...they come in handy.....the only gaurenteed grab for kabal that i know of is in hooksword after overhead kick......after the long hooksword combo u have very little chance to grab cuz opp. has opportunity to duck.

i'd like to see your kabal in action too. smile
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m2dave
04/01/2005 04:35 AM (UTC)
0
Speaking about Kabal,he seems like a good character to counter Dairou.However,when Molson uses Kabal against my Dairou,he seems harder than a Bo player to me (not an exaggeration)...sad

The fact is Kabal has u+2 and 4 in his weapon stance that are basically unpunishable due to the buffered Spin that virtually evades everything you do.To make it even worse,if you abuse the TS Drop at sweep distance,you risk eating a Spin into 50% of damage.At least you can break BRC's f+3 with your breaker after a missed TS Drop up close,but you cannot break Kabal's Spin;you can't backdash from,side step it,or block it in Dairou's case (you can,but it's hard after a missed TS Drop).

Just thought I'd let you guys know.I need to figure out a new strategy against this shit.It's annoying me lol.I'm supposed to beat everyone...tongue
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Versatile
04/01/2005 11:49 PM (UTC)
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Chrome Wrote:
Just for comparison, can anyone of you guys make a list of MKDA and MKD? lets compare the two. I don't think Sub-Zero sucked that uch back in MKDA.


MKD - look on page 1..lol

MKDA - This is from memory and I might blank out sometimes or confuse some spots up, but I think this is fairly accurate.

1. Scorpion
2. Bo Rai Cho
3. Reptile
4. Drahmin
5. Sonya
6. Shang Tsung
7. Hsu Hao
8. Frost
9. Jax
10. Quan Chi
11. Mavado
12. Kenshi
13. Raiden
14. Kung Lao
15. Nitara
16. Mokap
17. Johnny Cage
18. Sub-Zero
19. Li Mei
20. Blaze
21. Kano
22. Kitana
23. Cyrax

Yeah, tier wise Sub-Zero is better but he isn't a better character. Basically if MKD Sub faced MKDA Sub, MKD Sub would win most the time IMO. Just a better character. Like it has been said earlier, it's not that MKD Sub is worse..it's just that every character is better.

Didn't check out those match vids yet cuz I'm not currently on DSL, but I will soon. I enjoyed the matches with Konq vs Danb!
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Konqrr
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MKII is a Glorified RPG...Turn Based Chip Damage!
04/10/2005 09:43 PM (UTC)
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After careful consideration, playing countless players and discovering how good Kabal is...I'm moving him to the #9 spot knocking Mileena down one to #10. At first I was going to put him above Darrius under Scorp, but Darrius and Liu and Jinko are better than Kabal.

Yoda should be happy that Kabal is now in the Top 10.
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ThuggishRuggish
04/11/2005 02:13 AM (UTC)
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so wheres raiden on this list?
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skysantosh
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Kenshi Wins-Fatality!

04/17/2005 10:36 AM (UTC)
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why is kenshi so low on the list? I've only ever lost once as kenshi and that wox to a sub-zero player. So wud sum1 care to explain why he is so low?smile
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Konqrr
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MKII is a Glorified RPG...Turn Based Chip Damage!
04/17/2005 12:22 PM (UTC)
0
Because he sucks compared to the other fighters.

Ashrah moves up too...42% unbreakable double throw.
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skysantosh
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Kenshi Wins-Fatality!

04/17/2005 03:07 PM (UTC)
0
how duz he suck? He's good at far range, has good specials, good fatalities but not so good combos. He is the only fighter who is actually a challenge! So tell me why he sucks?wink
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Omega Supreme
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There are three rules for doing scientific research. Unfortunately, no one knows what they are.

04/17/2005 03:26 PM (UTC)
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Konqrr Wrote:
After careful consideration, playing countless players and discovering how good Kabal is...I'm moving him to the #9 spot knocking Mileena down one to #10. At first I was going to put him above Darrius under Scorp, but Darrius and Liu and Jinko are better than Kabal.

Yoda should be happy that Kabal is now in the Top 10.


Hooray!

I think that's fair, yes.

VQ
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Sub-Zero_7th
04/17/2005 05:14 PM (UTC)
0
I'm still wondering about Shao Kahn's rank.

Anyway, I find Kenshi to be a lot worse than he was in MKDA. In MKDA, he was pretty good, but in MKD, he feels weaker, far less fluid, and not as useful.
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Bizatch
04/17/2005 10:26 PM (UTC)
0
Konqrr Wrote:
Ashrah moves up too...42% unbreakable double throw.


Not to mention a 100%+ combo in the middle of the stage that's rather easy to pull off.
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Clockwork-Orange
04/19/2005 04:00 AM (UTC)
0
i'm surprised my sub zero aint made konqrr move im up any =)
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ToxicBomB
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Bleh

04/19/2005 04:59 PM (UTC)
0
im actually suprised myself that sub-zero isnt higher. I think its because it requires some strategy to use him; Leading people into ice clone can be hard but if you can catch people while they do combos its great.
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GetTheYayo
04/28/2005 06:22 PM (UTC)
0
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