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shrairyuwarrior
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04/25/2015 10:00 PM (UTC)
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Ok OP let me clarify a few things some posters got wrong. First the Kamidogu in the comic book being collected by Havik have NOTHING to do with the Kamidogu from Deception. The writer of th e comic confirmed to me on Twitter when I asked, him saying that the daggers are something else.

Also while the event are happier different and later concise ring it's been 25 years rather then just over ten since MK4 DA didn't happen because Li mei village was shinnok fault Shang is dead and Liu kang died by raiden, not Shang this time. Plus Shujinko is still looking for the kamidogu. In this timeline he's just taking longer. So Onaga isn't freed yet.
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mattteo
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04/26/2015 12:01 AM (UTC)
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The writers said in their original script Kai was in the place of Bo' Rai Cho. I imagine they decided to use the more popular character instead.

As for the main topic, I think Onaga and Armageddon will be avoided completely this time around. Taven and Daegon get wrapped up in ladder endings in MKX, as does Shujinko. I imagine they're going a totally different direction, and I'm glad.


Kai was in the place of Bo' Rai Cho???
Can you please tell me more about this original script? Where did the writers say that? Thanks in advance.

Also, I hope Taven and Daegon come back. I feel that Aegus and Delia's plan is correct from their perspective of Edenian Gods, but we can't agree with it because we think like mortals. I thought it was pretty good writing.
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ErmacYou
04/26/2015 01:46 AM (UTC)
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Onaga Wrote:
It's just been postponed from the looks of it. The events will still unfold, just not exactly as they did before.

Who's to say Onaga needs Reptile's body? Who's to say he really needed anyone to be there when that egg cracked?

Quan Chi dying means nothing because...well where do bad people go when they die in MK? Yeah, he's fine. Things seemed to go exactly how he wanted in MKX so..yeah.

Taven has been acknowledged, Daegon is still at large. And Shujinko is wandering around so...it's likely we are catching right up to the events of Armageddon.



about daegon...



Spoilers: (Highlight to reveal)
kenshi killed him in his ending and daegon killed argus and daelia so there's that
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mattteo
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04/26/2015 02:41 AM (UTC)
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about daegon...



Spoilers: (Highlight to reveal)
kenshi killed him in his ending and daegon killed argus and daelia so there's that



I can't believe you have 1000+ comments on this site and you don't know that an ending is only an indication of things to come.smile
The next game will most likely include Takeda's search for Daegon. We'll see if he gets the typical villain treatment in MK (killed by the good guys, eg: Quan Chi ) or if he slaps that teen Takeda ass silly.
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Blade4693
04/26/2015 02:52 AM (UTC)
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Wait, I can see how many posts I have? How? I'm curious lol
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BiohazardEXTREME
04/26/2015 05:14 AM (UTC)
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mattteo Wrote:
about daegon...



Spoilers: (Highlight to reveal)
kenshi killed him in his ending and daegon killed argus and daelia so there's that



I can't believe you have 1000+ comments on this site and you don't know that an ending is only an indication of things to come.smile
The next game will most likely include Takeda's search for Daegon. We'll see if he gets the typical villain treatment in MK (killed by the good guys, eg: Quan Chi ) or if he slaps that teen Takeda ass silly.


Well, that's not necessarily the case either. There's always the possibility they'll ignore that story arc all together, and we can keep guessing whether the ending happened or not.
Not every ending is an indicator to what'll actually happen in the next game.
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Chrome
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04/26/2015 08:10 AM (UTC)
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BiohazardEXTREME Wrote:
Onaga Wrote:
Chrome Wrote:
Funny thing is, nothing actually happened so far that would prevent or hinder Amrageddon. In fact, it is actually worse, as Blaze is probably still enslaved, th Dragon King does not really factor into the whole thing, and Daegon is around.


Plus new combatants, so the number of combatants is still growing, meaning that the failsafe will not be able to operate...


Argus and Delia were grand category retards with their plan.


Damn it Chrome, I hate to agree with you but, yeah! I have been saying this since the end of the last game. The only thing ever changed about Armageddon was the outcome. Shao Kahn won't win now because for all we know the Elder Gods straight up wiped him from existence.

But Armageddon is still right on track because the reason it happens is...well you already said it. Too many super powered warriors. And now they're breeding!


But it's not actually right on track, because while there's no official year by year timeline for the original canon, I'm quite sure that it isn't happening 25 years after MK1. MKDA happens 10 years after MK1, and even if several years pass between that, Deception and Armageddon, I'm quite sure it's not a 15 year time span. I'm pretty sure that when Taven encountered Sonya in Armageddon, she wasn't 51 years old. So in terms of the actual timeline, MKX has already surpassed the "date" of the original Armageddon.


That is true, this timeline is elongated further into the future if we assume that MK1 happened on the same dates as in the original timeline.

HOWEVER, the prerequisites for the Armageddon scenario are still intact. keep in mind that even if their plan was pants on head retarded it was a failsafe against a WORSE case.

The process may have been slowed but ultimately nothing has been done to avert it.
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ImperatrixSindel
04/26/2015 08:17 AM (UTC)
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mattteo Wrote:
The writers said in their original script Kai was in the place of Bo' Rai Cho. I imagine they decided to use the more popular character instead.

As for the main topic, I think Onaga and Armageddon will be avoided completely this time around. Taven and Daegon get wrapped up in ladder endings in MKX, as does Shujinko. I imagine they're going a totally different direction, and I'm glad.


Kai was in the place of Bo' Rai Cho???
Can you please tell me more about this original script? Where did the writers say that? Thanks in advance.

Also, I hope Taven and Daegon come back. I feel that Aegus and Delia's plan is correct from their perspective of Edenian Gods, but we can't agree with it because we think like mortals. I thought it was pretty good writing.


The Kai tidbit was mentioned on Twitter by one of the writers. I'm afraid I don't have a link handy.
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BiohazardEXTREME
04/26/2015 08:52 AM (UTC)
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Chrome Wrote:


That is true, this timeline is elongated further into the future if we assume that MK1 happened on the same dates as in the original timeline.

HOWEVER, the prerequisites for the Armageddon scenario are still intact. keep in mind that even if their plan was pants on head retarded it was a failsafe against a WORSE case.

The process may have been slowed but ultimately nothing has been done to avert it.


But the thing is, first of all, that whole setup was pretty vague. What's this worst case scenario? What would happen? It's never really been clarified.

The other thing is, it was basically caused by a lack of 'balance', which, again, not very clear. Basically all we know is that the "kombatants" were growing too strong and numerous for the realms to handle, and that's sketchy at best. Who's to say that hasn't been prevented? The way I see it, the problem was that the realms were in constant threat of a merger onto each other. First Shao Kahn invades, then Shinnok, few years later, the Deadly Alliance and before that's even done, it's the Dragon King. It was just one invasion after another, and all from different characters, with different allegiances, building armies, and just causing a hell of a lot of chaos.

Not only has MK9 seen a lot of the characters die off (many of which, as of right now, still permanently dead), but MKX has generally shown a lot more stability than the previous games. As far as we can tell, after the original Netherrealm war, there have been no more attempts for one realm to invade another. Outworld is struggling with its own political issues, and Mileena has had a hard enough time retaining her place on the throne, meanwhile Earth itself has been taking time to rebuild, characters like Sub-Zero and Scorpion finding redemption, characters like Cage and Sonya, and Jax building a family life and having kids (even if in the former case, that family life didn't last). It doesn't feel like the combatants have grown too numerous or too powerful. It may just be that by screwing everything up, Raiden actually prevented Armageddon not just by destroying Shao Kahn, but by maintaining a bit of a balance.

Either way, somehow, I doubt they'll be rehashing the Armageddon plot line.
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PsychoFight
04/26/2015 09:28 AM (UTC)
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The OP is talking about Shujinko's quest in attaining the Kamidogu...how it started and unfolded, etc.

Unless the next MK game retcons it, it's part of established history and is canonical in BOTH timelines. In the MK2011 timeline, this happened but not necessarily as you see in-game...just that it happened in general (same with MK Mythologies: Sub-Zero). Shujinko was approached by "Damashi" and went on a lifelong quest to attain the tools of the Elder Gods for some unknown purpose. That much is known.

By the way, established history is defined as every event and backstory that is acknowledged right before Raiden makes that first change - everything that's already set up right as MK2011 starts.
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TigrarShokan
04/26/2015 12:30 PM (UTC)
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SaurienDeity Wrote:
You're trolling, right? Or did you just not play MK9?

Ok I'll bite. The 3D timeline was subverted when Raiden changed history. It never happened.


The 3d timeline, aka the original timeline still exist, whenever anyone changes something by going back in time, an alternate reality is created. Didn't you watch Back to the Future or Star Trek.
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Gillbob316
04/26/2015 03:17 PM (UTC)
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As far as I'm concerned, the major issues are just the Onaga plot and the Taven/Daegon plot. Because those were both set in motion before MK1 and should still have theoretically been happening. (I'm sure there are other minor plots too, but they're likely less notable)

I presume one of the major purposes of the current comic book storyline is to put a cork in the MKD/Onaga/Shujinko/Kamidogu plot. The comic book seems to specifically be addressing "Hey, if Shujinko isn't gathering the Kamidogu, who the hell is?"

I assume they're keeping the exact whys and wheres of Onaga himself vague and unspoken, because he was one of the better things to come out of the 3D era, and SHOULD they want to revist him, they're not writing themselves into a corner by killing him in the comic or something.

As for MKA, they seem to be addressing the Taven/Daegon plot in Kenshi and Takeda's endings... which I could easily see becoming canon in the next game... though I honestly don't think they'll want to bring Taven back, so... who knows.
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BiohazardEXTREME
04/26/2015 05:40 PM (UTC)
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PsychoFight Wrote:
The OP is talking about Shujinko's quest in attaining the Kamidogu...how it started and unfolded, etc.

Unless the next MK game retcons it, it's part of established history and is canonical in BOTH timelines. In the MK2011 timeline, this happened but not necessarily as you see in-game...just that it happened in general (same with MK Mythologies: Sub-Zero). Shujinko was approached by "Damashi" and went on a lifelong quest to attain the tools of the Elder Gods for some unknown purpose. That much is known.

By the way, established history is defined as every event and backstory that is acknowledged right before Raiden makes that first change - everything that's already set up right as MK2011 starts.


The thing is, just because those events were set in motion at one point, doesn't mean they haven't been prevented. The biggest factor in Shujinko's quest right now is the fact that Edenia is still merged with Outworld and neither Sindel nor Kitana have any governing over it. The Kamidogu could be stuck wedged between two mountains for all we know. It may just be impossible to get to. Who knows how Sindel even got a hold of it before handing it off to Shujinko in Edenia? So yeah, that may mean he'll die an old man long before Edenia is ever freed.

And the events of Armageddon could be prevented in the same way. What Delia foresaw was obviously the events of the original timeline, but if Raiden mucked that up, they really may never even happen.
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frabn
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Well, you all got your Tremor now. Can we finally move on?

04/27/2015 07:02 AM (UTC)
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It sucked, so they retconned it.
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Khali
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Watch the pain as it disappears

04/27/2015 07:22 AM (UTC)
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IMHO, Armageddon will still happen. Only difference will be that Raiden will destroy Blaze and the egg in defense of Earthrealm and become the bringer of the coming Armageddon. A sort of throwback to his MK1 ending where he and other Elder Gods destroyed Earthrealm while fighting in Raidens MK tournament.
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Chrome
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04/27/2015 07:28 AM (UTC)
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Khali Wrote:
IMHO, Armageddon will still happen. Only difference will be that Raiden will destroy Blaze and the egg in defense of Earthrealm and become the bringer of the coming Armageddon. A sort of throwback to his MK1 ending where he and other Elder Gods destroyed Earthrealm while fighting in Raidens MK tournament.


They weren't even elder gods, back in MK those thigns did not even exist.

The whole reason for the tournament and the general cosmological setup of the MKverse makes no sense.
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mattteo
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04/27/2015 08:25 AM (UTC)
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TigrarShokan Wrote:
SaurienDeity Wrote:
You're trolling, right? Or did you just not play MK9?

Ok I'll bite. The 3D timeline was subverted when Raiden changed history. It never happened.


The 3d timeline, aka the original timeline still exist, whenever anyone changes something by going back in time, an alternate reality is created. Didn't you watch Back to the Future or Star Trek.


I can't tell if you're trolling or if you're just....ummm...naive.

If you're serious, then you must win a physics award for enlightening us!
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mattteo
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04/27/2015 08:27 AM (UTC)
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The biggest factor in Shujinko's quest right now is the fact that Edenia is still merged with Outworld and neither Sindel nor Kitana have any governing over it. The Kamidogu could be stuck wedged between two mountains for all we know. It may just be impossible to get to.


That's NOT how merging works
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mattteo
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04/27/2015 08:28 AM (UTC)
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As for MKA, they seem to be addressing the Taven/Daegon plot in Kenshi and Takeda's endings... which I could easily see becoming canon in the next game... though I honestly don't think they'll want to bring Taven back, so... who knows.


Why not? I'd bring back both Taven and Daegon
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TigrarShokan
04/27/2015 10:25 AM (UTC)
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mattteo Wrote:
TigrarShokan Wrote:
SaurienDeity Wrote:
You're trolling, right? Or did you just not play MK9?

Ok I'll bite. The 3D timeline was subverted when Raiden changed history. It never happened.


The 3d timeline, aka the original timeline still exist, whenever anyone changes something by going back in time, an alternate reality is created. Didn't you watch Back to the Future or Star Trek.


I can't tell if you're trolling or if you're just....ummm...naive.

If you're serious, then you must win a physics award for enlightening us!



I actually have a degree in theoretical physics, and this the kind of shit we postulate. There is nothing naive about it. Actually come to think about the whole MK universe should cease to exist because Shao Kahn is dead. If he dies Raiden doesn't send himself a message from the future after getting his as kicked by him. Ergo a paradox now exist. This means Shao Kahn must still be alive!
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mattteo
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04/27/2015 10:37 AM (UTC)
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I actually have a degree in theoretical physics, and this the kind of shit we postulate. There is nothing naive about it. Actually come to think about the whole MK universe should cease to exist because Shao Kahn is dead. If he dies Raiden doesn't send himself a message from the future after getting his as kicked by him. Ergo a paradox now exist. This means Shao Kahn must still be alive!


Wow! That's some serious stuff there Mr PhD. Did you read a lot of proven scientific theories to come up with that?
The truth is nobody knows how time/space works.

Raiden had a vision of a possible future as he was in the audience of the first tournament. MK1 to MKA were always visions of the future. They never happened.
As stupid as that interpretation sounds, it has a lot more in accordance with real physics than parallel universes. That's not even a gullible scientific theory outside of media elevated physicists like Michio Kaku and other famous wannabes , it's just a gimmick used in sci-fi or television. Parallel universes don't have to share the same rules as our own and really don't have identical counterparts of ourselves. You do realize that the concept of the infinity of atoms and molecules in the Universe that can be in a slightly different position in every infinite timeline of parallel universes is stupid, right?
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AFKAW
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Artist Formerly Known as Who...?

04/27/2015 12:56 PM (UTC)
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MKA was self-fullfiling prophecy.

Quan Chi, on orders from Shinnok, has gathered all evil kombatants in Edenia crater, because Shinnok knew about Argus plan and wanted to wipe-out all resistance to his return. This battle was seen by Delia in her visions, hence Argus created his plan, which was used by Shinnok to gather people in the crater...e.t.c.

It's a loop.

Now, since Shinnok and Quan Chi are out of the picture (to some degree), there is no-one to gather people in the crater. Basically someone else must kickstart MKA, now, which could go against Delia's vision.
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ImperatrixSindel
04/27/2015 04:07 PM (UTC)
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The bottom line honestly is critics and fans alike hated Armageddon and there's almost certainly no way they're going to rehash any of it.

The entire point of the reboot in MK9 so far as I can tell was to retcon out the 3D era storyline.
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kamouniyak
04/27/2015 04:16 PM (UTC)
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ImperatrixSindel Wrote:
The bottom line honestly is critics and fans alike hated Armageddon and there's almost certainly no way they're going to rehash any of it.

The entire point of the reboot in MK9 so far as I can tell was to retcon out the 3D era storyline.


No, that's incorrect. I don't know how many fans hated Armageddon. I personally loved that game's story. The reviews were positive for it so the critics didn't hate it either. It made good money CONSIDERING how much was invested.
They rebooted because the common fans kept demanding original characters, who are now boring as hell. I'd rather see Reiko any day than Kano, Jax, Sonya and the other blah original chars. The 3d characters just needed the time to become known by the common fans (most of whom had no idea of the story the 3d chars had) and today they have achieved that. It's time Mortal Kombat brings them to the spotlight again.
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TigrarShokan
04/27/2015 08:43 PM (UTC)
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mattteo Wrote:
I actually have a degree in theoretical physics, and this the kind of shit we postulate. There is nothing naive about it. Actually come to think about the whole MK universe should cease to exist because Shao Kahn is dead. If he dies Raiden doesn't send himself a message from the future after getting his as kicked by him. Ergo a paradox now exist. This means Shao Kahn must still be alive!


Wow! That's some serious stuff there Mr PhD. Did you read a lot of proven scientific theories to come up with that?
The truth is nobody knows how time/space works.

Raiden had a vision of a possible future as he was in the audience of the first tournament. MK1 to MKA were always visions of the future. They never happened.
As stupid as that interpretation sounds, it has a lot more in accordance with real physics than parallel universes. That's not even a gullible scientific theory outside of media elevated physicists like Michio Kaku and other famous wannabes , it's just a gimmick used in sci-fi or television. Parallel universes don't have to share the same rules as our own and really don't have identical counterparts of ourselves. You do realize that the concept of the infinity of atoms and molecules in the Universe that can be in a slightly different position in every infinite timeline of parallel universes is stupid, right?



You said visions of a possible future, so are you saying that he was dreaming the whole time? If he only had a vision or dream, why does the physical state of his amulet break? Pretty serious dream. Also you refer to it as a possible future, does this mean there is more than one? You are contradicting yourshelf here. yes they are only theories like evolution, nobody has actually seen a dinosaur right. Could be part of the illuminati plot to deceive, go around putting fake bones in the ground to confuse the creationists.
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