Dont scrap older characters
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posted12/23/2008 11:46 PM (UTC)by
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ShaolinChuan
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04/28/2003 02:49 AM (UTC)
Kung Lao
Liu Kang
Scorpion
Subzero
Sonya
Baraka
Kitana
Shang Tsung
Kano
Raiden
Jax
Mileena
Reptile
Quan Chi
Johnny Cage


These are the main staple characters of Mortal Kombat. After MKvsDC, it would be hard to imagine a game without them. Now we know that Ed Boon wanted to scrap all the characters for the next real MK game, but at this point in time that wouldn't be such a good idea. Midway can't risk to lose any of the fans they have left. I know that they've also promised us Subzero and Scorpion never to be missed from any game, but that's not enough.

Let's face it, the last few games have had a lot of filler, boring, uninteresting characters. That would go for Kobra, Darrius, Kira, Li Mei, Hsu Hao, Mavado, Taven, and Daegon. I also wouldn't care if Kai, Reiko, Fujin, Sektor, Cyrax, Smoke, Shao Khan, Goro, Sheeva, Meat, Chameleon, Kintaro, Onaga, Blaze, Jarek, Motaro, Rain, Nightwolf, Noob, and Stryker never see the light of day again.

The better of the newest characters would be Hotaru, Bo Rai Cho, Kenshi, Drahmin, and Havik.

As far as storyline goes, there needs to be a new TOURNAMENT. Everybody for themselves kinda thing. No more saving the galaxy stuff. Give Shang Tsung the power he once had and make him the ultimate badass! Shao who?

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XiahouDun84
12/15/2008 05:15 PM (UTC)
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Disagree. I would love to see the majority of the sacred cows gone forever.

However, I actually kind of doubt that will happen now. Since MK vs. DC pretty much bombed and they're probably going to be desperate for sales, they'll likely...yet again....try to cater to the nostalgic; which means more old characters, story regression, and recycling old formulas.

Happy days ahead.
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RazorsEdge701
12/16/2008 03:24 AM (UTC)
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Personally, I think the lesson to be learned from MK vs DCU is that with Mortal Kombat, nostalgia doesn't sell.
Deadly Alliance was their best selling title of the past generation and it was the game that killed off Liu and Shao Kahn and had the most new characters. What the numbers say people want, therefore, is newness and change. They want a new MKDA, not more MK2.
The mainstream thinks MK is dead and have been ignoring the sequels for years. Making more games that look like the old ones isn't ever going to convince them they're wrong.
And by clinging so tightly to the MK1 and 2 cast, all you're doing is telling us you'd be happier if you were actually playing MK2. Why target a sequel at you when all you seem to want are the old games? Why not just give you copies of the old games, or maybe make remakes instead?
Besides, what makes Kano, Baraka, and Jax any different from those characters you called filler like Li Mei and Mavado? They're filler too and you're blinded by childhood memories or you'd see that.
Time to live in the present and think about the future, my friend. Evolve or die.
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ThePredator151
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12/16/2008 05:13 AM (UTC)
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Disagree too man. But to an extent though.

I don't think scrapping characters that logically shouldn't go away is a good idea. This considers the weight, and development of the character too.

1. Gods (Raiden, Fujin, ect...) - don't age and is extremely rare that they're ever actually killed for good.

2. Edenians (Kitana, Jade ect..) - Apparently, they just live alot longer.

3. Sub-Zero - Cold slows down aging cells scientifically speaking. Sub-Zero is the master of that art form so....we should probably keep seeing him for a while. I'd probably give him a good 200yrs of continuously active age. Also though, his character could continue to see lineage, or successors as well.

4. Scorpion - or anything else that is inexplicably walking around dead - Well? If it's not like Scorpion, it ages and can die for good. Yes, Zombie Liu Kangs anatomic structure should still be deteriorating until it eventually just can't hold together anymore.

5. Maybe robots - unless they advance technologically, they age though. Rust, and become outdated.

Everyone else should have to be blessed//cursed or granted some immunity to the way aging and death works. Otherwise, they should leave Mortal Kombat for whatever reason.

Good, New characters need to come on through now. The ushers for them, should be those couple few main stay characters. Depending on how the new characters are influenced (good, bad, or not at all), should tell us where they are vested as far as alignment is concerned. Good, Bad, Neutral, or otherwise.

I know that's not complete but, that's what I think.
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Chrome
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12/16/2008 07:43 AM (UTC)
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Kill all.

Personal tragedies over a silicone-based character interest me the least. If you think you have any word or right in the matter than wake up.

Wake up and hopefully smell the ashes.
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RazorsEdge701
12/16/2008 07:45 AM (UTC)
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Silicone is what breast implants are made of.
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Thrawn
12/17/2008 10:57 AM (UTC)
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I agree mostly with ShaolinChuan. Keep 70% of the roster old characters. After mk4 the track record of introducing new characters wasn't that great. Darrius, Dairou, Kobra, Drahmin, Hsu Hao, Taven, Daegon, Shujinko.

I firmly believe in staying with what brought you to the dance. I play mk for the Mortal Kombat characters who I have been using for 10+ years, not some new dude I don't have any attachment to.

By all means introduce new characters, just introduce 3-5 and concentrate on developing them well. Lets not forget that most of the new characters we get usually end up being reskinned versions of old ones using the same special moves.

Kenshi=Ermac
Jarek=Kano
Li Mei in mkda used Sais. Now c'mon. NO mk female except Mileena can use sais. That was blasphemy.
Shujinko reused all recycled moves.

RazorsEdge701, I have got to respectfully disagree with you on mk vs dc. I don't think nostalgia had anything to do with mk vs dc selling or not selling. I think it is still too early to judge the final numbers on that game, it's only been a month.

And as far as some of the mk vs dc roster picks upsetting people, that was only because so many of the characters from mk 1-4 are popular and having those damn dc characters take up half the roster meant every spot was so coveted.

Reptile, Smoke, Mileena, Fujin, Noob, Ermac, Sindel, Tanya, Quan Chi, Kabal, Cyrax, and Sektor fans all wanted their characters to get a spot.

Let us also not forget that before every new game that comes out, there ends up being massive calls for many characters to return, because they all have so many fans. I remember that one of the main marketing strategies for mkd was the return of old characters Mileena, Sindel, Kabal, Nightwolf, Jade, Baraka, Tanya, Noob, and Smoke. All klassic characters.

I personally don't completely understand the attitude of some fans (I'm not knocking their opinions) who state we want all the old characters gone. No more Scorpion, Sub Zero, Raiden, Sonya, or Kitana. They have had their time.

My honest response is "Then why do like mk if you are tired of the mk characters? Why don't you just play a different series then?"

You don't read a Batman comic book and say the Joker and Catwoman have been around for 70 years, time to kill them off and bring in new villains.

Now that I think about it, that is another good point. In the last 15 or so years writers in Batman comics have been trying to come up with new villains and many have been created, but almost all of them faded away and fans always ended up wanting the classic villains back.

Mkda sold well, it was also the first mk game in over 5 years I think it was. That contributed a lot to it's success.It's roster was also half returnig and half new.

I'm not against new characters, far from it, I just think the first priority of any new mk game should be to develop existing characters first, not throw in a bunch of shallow new characters just to say "Look new blood!"


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RazorsEdge701
12/17/2008 11:12 AM (UTC)
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Comic books are a status quo medium, the story never ends. Games like MK are a finite medium, the story has to end some day. MK characters must grow, change, evolve, retire, and die because time does pass for them.

I don't play the game for any individual characters, I play it to see the FULL story, and there's no reason to follow that story if no one ever changes, nothing permanent ever happens, and the new characters don't stick around and prove that they matter.
When you just repeat the same story over and over and over again, you get Mario and Zelda, children's stories.
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Thrawn
12/17/2008 11:28 AM (UTC)
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RazorsEdge701 you wrote that mk games are a finite medium. I don't agree. 20 years from now the mk license, whoever owns it at the time is going to be still churning out mk games. It is a very lucrative franchise and a household name. Just like Super Mario Bros., Zelda, Sonic, Street Fighter, or Tomb Raider. It may be a remake or a reboot, but some company is always going to look at it and see a buck to be made. It has name recognition.
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RazorsEdge701
12/17/2008 11:31 AM (UTC)
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Street Fighter is also a finite story with change and evolution. The only returning characters in SF3 were Ken, Ryu, Chun Li, and Akuma.

In fact, they had to make SF4 take place BEFORE 3 in the story to explain why they brought back a bunch of SF2 characters.
Maybe there will still be MK games 20 years from now, but do you really believe they'll have Sonya and Johnny Cage in them? Scorpion and Sub-Zero will still be around, sure, those are mascots. But everyone else is fair game.
Since the beginning, MK has been making major changes to characters and allowing them to at times disappear or die. Evolution and change is already a part of the series' storytelling techniques. Old characters WILL leave and new ones WILL show up.
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Thrawn
12/17/2008 11:36 AM (UTC)
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Didn't they do a Sf3 2nd impact or something similar to umk where they brought back some old characters? I don't remember.

If sf4 is a prequel than they really shouldn't haven't called it sf4. I don't know though I haven't been following sf4 that closely. I just watched some videos of it the other day and it looked pretty sweet. Can't wait to buy it. Absolutely they will still have Sonya, Kano, Kitana, Raiden and Johnny Cage in them. Nostalgia and name recognition.
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RazorsEdge701
12/17/2008 11:41 AM (UTC)
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In the original release of SF3, only Ken and Ryu returned. Second Impact brought back Akuma and 3rd Strike brought back Chun Li.

No other characters from past games came back.

And yeah, I don't know why they numbered it 4 if it's a prequel to 3, but that's Capcom for you, I guess. Devil May Cry 3 is a prequel to DMC 1 too. I'm not sure they have any idea how numbers are supposed to work, lol.
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Chrome
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About Me

12/18/2008 04:46 PM (UTC)
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Conventionalism and nostalgia killed MK to begin with...
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RazorsEdge701
12/18/2008 04:49 PM (UTC)
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That must've been a hell of a trick since it ain't actually dead yet. Can I borrow your time machine?
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Thrawn
12/19/2008 01:00 AM (UTC)
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RazorsEdge701 Wrote:
That must've been a hell of a trick since it ain't actually dead yet. Can I borrow your time machine?


It would be sweet if it was a DeLorean.
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Asesino
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12/23/2008 06:19 AM (UTC)
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Noob is classic, he mut replace Mileena in your list dude.
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Chill728
12/23/2008 11:46 PM (UTC)
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I wouldn't mind if they scrapped all of the older characters, as long as they have decent characters to replace them. In the previous-gen MK, I didn't see many characters that would be keepers. I guess you can give credit to the MK Team for not fleshing them out as well as they should.

Sure a few of the icons should stay like Scorpion and Raiden, but bringing in a good team of new characters as well would be nice.

But if they ever did kill off the classics like Liu Kang or Sub-Zero, I'd hope they would have plausible reasons for death and not some horrible last minute bullshit.


XiahouDun84 Wrote:
Disagree. I would love to see the majority of the sacred cows gone forever.

However, I actually kind of doubt that will happen now. Since MK vs. DC pretty much bombed and they're probably going to be desperate for sales, they'll likely...yet again....try to cater to the nostalgic; which means more old characters, story regression, and recycling old formulas.

Happy days ahead.



Guess I heard the wrong sales figures. People were telling me it sold around 500,000 copies.

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