So childish . You are telling everyone they got fucked over because they bought an MK game... You are on an MK fan site. You go farther with childish "bend over and take it up the ass". That is equivalent to..? Not paying for easy fatalities, or Krypt unlocks, but having them there?

Your analogy to starving shows your childishness. It is a video game. Your analogy would be more viable if you compared begging for food to working for food as opposed to begging for food to death from starvation.

I like how you put in quotes something that doesn't even resemble what I said. Then call me the phony one.

Whether it's shady or not is debatable, sure, I'll give you that. You don't know a lot about the decision process, the economics, or the inner workings of NRS and WB. Why don't you "grow up and admit it".

@newt27

.......................

When did I say you got fucked over because you bought the game? I said that they fucked us over because we trusted in them not to go for the B.S micro-transactions but they did.

I still find it funny that you are trying to defend bullshit like Goro being fully on disk and part of the actual game which you pay for and yet he is locked behind a pay wall, it's funny because you call me close-minded and yet your sight is really short when it comes to this debate.

You are telling me it's debatable? It isn't, it's a fact that when you pay for the disk you should get EVERYTHING you pay for that is on DISK.

We obviously have something locked which is Goro.

Other than that you have the B.S with the MT which is an obvious bait otherwise they wouldn't have lowered the amount of koin rewards you get.

My analogy was right on point, it was extreme but it was true.

Also I love how you are trying to get everybody to go against me by saying "You are telling everyone they got fucked over because they bought an MK game... You are on an MK fan site. You go farther with childish "bend over and take it up the ass"."

Don't twist my words, buddy. I didn't say you got fucked over because you bought an MK game, I said you got fucked over by NRS because you trusted in them and thought they weren't going to stoop so low.

I love MK, I don't have to like the people who make it.

I love Pizza, I don't have to like the people who make it. But I guess by your flawed logic, I do have to love the people who make it regardless of their B.S.

Sometimes my online experience is bear flawless and sometimes it feels like I'm playing like MKD or something. For the part it's fine but occasionally I'll find myself wondering what the fuck is happening.

I think he was drawing the attention of the naysayers to the fact that NRS has been shady, explaining how NRS has "pulled one over on us". The NRS/WB comment was in response to someone else claiming that we need to point the finger at WB. The analogies are just analogies, and I believe he did say "I know it is extreme".

To the main point I agree. I am a fan, but I can see where things are changing. It is up to the community to voice that SOME of these changes are not okay. I don't want to see endless micro transactions in future MK games.

Interesting. Well, I agree at least the netcode could be better. My matches are not lag-fests but the button input is a lil off sometimes. They've still been incredibly enjoyable though.

One of the more poorer reviews Joe has done. I like Joe but the review was average.

Joe is too cynical. Anything DLC related and he just gets red mist in front of his eyes. The easy fatality is garbage and is only in the game to get money out of people with more money than sense. The fatalities in the game are the easiest they have ever been to pull off(not including MK4 where you could just do an uppercut to do a fatality). There is a tuturial for them and the inputs are so easy. One of Kenshi's Fatality's is Back, Forward, Back, Back. I can input that in less then a second. If anyone buys those fatality tokens then they deserve to be ripped off. I unlocked everything in the Krypt excluding the gambling in less than a week, This is smallest Krypt I think. Compare to the MK:DA Krypt where there were over 600 coffins and it had six different types of koins. That took weeks to unlock everything.

However the Goro thing is BS especially annoying here in the UK since you could only pre-order the Special Edition from GAME to actually get him.

He spends too much time comparing the game to MK9 as well. I think he was spoiled with MK9 and expects this game to have everythiing MK9 had.

Some of his reviews his bias gets the better of him. *Cough* Alien: Isolation *Cough*

"Also I still don't understand how people can be soooo blind, do you not realize that NRS/WB fucked you over, the lowered the koin rewards because they want you to buy the "Unlock all Krypt" that's low on a whole new level for NRS. "

Word for word from your first post in this thread. Sooooo by what your saying everyone who bought the game is getting fucked over because of what you go on to explain. Even if it doesn't effect their game experience.

I would like you to prove that they did lower the koin rewards. Also, I would like you to prove that the reason for them doing so was because they wanted to rake in more cash through the Krypt Unlock. If you did that, these wouldn't be completely empty claims. Reason to be suspicious, and reason to call it shady, sure. I wouldn't take it any farther than that.

You trusted in them not to go for micro transactions. Not we. You don't speak for everybody. I personally don't care, as long as it doesn't effect my game play experience. Which it doesn't.



Okay, so what if instead the game costs an extra 5$? What is the difference? The difference is you get to choose whether you want that extra material for that extra money or not, instead of it being forced upon you. They could have done this game with 24 more characters and 12 more chapters. But it would have been worth twice as much. I would prefer to have the normal game for 60$ and the optional 60$ add on as opposed to being forced to drop the whole $120 to play the game at all. We had a more in depth convo about this in an earlier thread. I made all my points about Goro there and I am not going to make them again.

Like I said it is debatable, and there are more factors than you are taking into account.



B.S. with the MT? Whut?

It was extreme....ly flawed. Your analogy assumed that the krypt unlockables are food. You imply that you can either beg for food, or you can suffer and die which you claim is similar to having to play for the unlockables or pay for the unlockables (or not get the unlockables at all?). It is flawed, because you imply that the only options are to beg for food to get it or don't get it at all. Whereas in the case of the Krypt you can either pay for it (beg for food) play for it (work for food) or not get it at all (starve and die).

You see the flaw, and why mine makes more sense, right?




Like I said above, that is what you trusted from them (apparently). All I trusted from them is to make an MK game that I enjoy. They did that perfectly well.



Funny, you said you "i like NRS" in your first post in this thread. Are you getting confused?

obviously you do not have to like the people who make the game to enjoy the game. But you do have to appreciate what they have done to a certain extent.

My logic and nothing I said previous to this even implies that you have to like the people who make the stuff you like. That one came straight out of your ass.

Nothing I said even implies that I like NRS nor did I say I like NRS. But if you are here, you obviously enjoy some of their work.
@moneyguy I Still think how shady they are is debatable. I don't think they have "pulled one over on us". As the guy above me said, Everything but Goro is for people who have more money than sense.
The analogies were extreme, but that wasn't my problem with them, as I stated above. There is a third option, which is not addressed in the analogy he made. His analogy would be accurate if you could only unlock the Krypt stuff by paying for it.
I am okay with the changes so far. Goro, like I said, is debatable. It would take more knowledge of the economics of the game in order for any of us to make a more informed opinion. They do have to pay the people working on this game... But I would hate to see the game littered with micro transactions as well. DLC characters are a different story though.

The only problem that I have with the koin payout is that they don't seem to give out combo or Player Card bonuses for two-player matches (at least not local ones -- maybe it's different online, but I don't play online). But the payout is pretty decent on the towers, and it's worlds better than the MKDA/MKD days when the goddamn onyx and platinum koins took so much time grinding through Test Your Patience games to get enough.

@newt27

You obviously are not that smart because you pointed out me saying

"Also I still don't understand how people can be soooo blind, do you not realize that NRS/WB fucked you over, the lowered the koin rewards because they want you to buy the "Unlock all Krypt" that's low on a whole new level for NRS. "

and you couldn't understand what I said here.

So let me try simplify it for you, I said they fucked us over because they lowered the koin rewards and baited us to buy the "Unlock all Krypt". They fucked us over because they went with Micro-transactions which is something shady.

I don't speak for all of you? That's true, but are you telling me people here don't trust in NRS? If so then you are a lair since you are the biggest NRS fanatic.

They obviously did something shady and yet you still stand defending them like the good sheep you are.

As for Goro, you showed me how "dumb" you are, for lack of better words. Let me try to help you.

Goro. Is. Part. Of. The. Game. You. Paid. 60. Dollars. For. He. Shouldn't. Be. Locked. Behind. A. Paywall. Because. You. Already. Paid. For. The. Disk. Which. He. Is. Already. On. Hope you understand now.

He is not an EXTRA he is part of the actual game, It's really weird how you still don't understand, you really are one of them good sheeps aren't you.

It's funny, it's like you are saying "Oh yeah I'll buy a fighting game with a character that I can unlock by paying 5$, I'll also buy the next fighting game they do and pay another 40$ for 2 characters that are already on disk and are part of the actual game, I LOVE NRS! :D."

That's where we are heading, sooner than you know it they'll only have Scorpion and Sub-zero unlocked and the rest you have to pay for on top of the 60$.

What's sad is that even then you'll still be here defending NRS saying "They are not forcing you to pay for your favorite character :D"

Ill admit, that last little part is a scary thought. Didn't the new Killer Instinct do something like that? You start with 1 character and all others you have to pay for?

Yeah, but Killer Instinct is a free to play game.

Ah well that makes sense. I was not aware of that lol

How much does each character usually cost?

$5

You haven't proved they did and the last sentence is your opinion. You sound ridiculous when you say your opinion as if it is fact. Hence my close-minded comment.

Remember how you said you hate brutalities even though you like doing them and do them all the time? That is the epitome of close-mindedness. You enjoy them but you hate them. And you tell me to grow up....



LMAO! Pathetic! As I stated, I only trust them to make a game I enjoy playing. Nothing else. You expect more? You sound like the "lair since you are the biggest NRS fanatic"



You make it too easy . I have stated at least twice now that it is debatable whether or not it is shady. You seemed to be more interested in insults than any evidence or ... logic. The fact that I admit it is debatable, and you say it isn't even though I am debating you on it, is another testament to how close-minded you are.



...Only if you pre ordered....

Tell that to someone who did not pre order, and you would be wrong. Dead wrong. Go ahead and argue. But they payed 60 dollars and cant play as Goro. Therefore, Goro. Is. Not. Part. Of. The. Game. They. Paid. 60. Dollars. For.




Your opinion.



He is on the disk but that doesn't mean he is a part of that 60$ you paid for. NRS makes that decision. I am not going to argue whether or not it was a good decision, we already did that in a different thread. You sounded "dumb" and close-minded there too.



I think it is weird how you make up your mind and refuse to change it. That makes you the best sheep of all.



It's funny, its like you are saying "I am not listening to you I make up my own shit to respond back to."

I said it is debatable. Obviously if that was the case I would be complaining too. But I didn't pay 5$ for Goro. Unless I could get that $40 worth of content for free by pre-ordering. Then I wouldn't care, but I would at least sympathize with the people who did not get a chance to pre-order, and sign a petition against it if it came up, because I almost missed the chance to pre-order for PS4.

Again, you are pulling this NRS fanboy shit out of your ass. Get over it.



You are condescending, disrespectful, childish, and close-minded.

You know where "we are heading"? I call bullshit, again. Stating your opinion as fact is getting real old. I already said I wouldn't defend them for the above example, so obviously I wouldn't defend them on your bullshit example.

Make a real argument and start being a little more respectful. Or at least show some proof of them lowering the koins payout in order to get more people to pay for the krypt.

I don't want to hear your opinion restated over and over again in weird and fluffy new ways.

On disk dlc is regularly regarded as a nefarious practice used by some game developers. That is not debatable.

It was proved that NRS patched the koin payout, however we can only make assumptions as to why. I don't believe that anyone would expect NRS to come out and say "We reduced the koin payout, to make out micro transactions more appealing.", however the evidence seems logically supported.

Take Corrupted Shinnok for example. On disk, not playable, but what if NRS patched it so he could become playable. In order to play him you had to pay five dollars for him. It is literally the same thing as what is happening with Goro now.

Dear god what have I started??????


Right so I'll just throw my 2 koins in here with regards to DLC, then I'm just gonna abandon this thread because I've created a shit storm.


If done right, DLC can be a GOOD thing. Disk locked content is shit, and should never have to be done.

The ideal good DLC is something that should equate to it's substance and dollar value.

Good DLC examples would be content that offers many hours of extra playtime, while also giving something new and meaningful. Take for example Far Cray: Blood Dragon, that game was DLC content, but it was also essentially it's own game. Same examples can be said for Red Dead Redemption's Undead Nightmare DLC, MORE CONTENT that is worth every penny of your money because it's adding more gameplay content.

The best developers out there that have a good track record for GOOD DLC that makes your paid for purchases well spent are CDProjekt Red and Rockstar just to name a couple.


BAD DLC can be things such as cosmetic skins that are WAY overpriced for their value, or content that SHOULD of been in the game, but was priced to damn much for what you get. (looking at you Bethesda, nobody forgot about the Horse Armor)


Basically in my eyes, good DLC should be something that adds HOURS more of extra gameplay content that is priced at a fair range.

Hell you COULD say that the PC expansion packs of ye oldy times were essentially DLC of that era, but it was good DLC (Diablo II: Lord of Destruction anyone?)


TL;DR: DLC should be something that adds MEANINGFUL content that makes you keep playing for hours and hours more than the original base game.

My 2 Koins on the matter, and now I vanish.

*WOOSH*

That is, because it is opinion. I don't know this is true, but the game could have gone up 5$ in price instead of having Goro for $5 (or free if you preorder. Let's not forget that important tidbit. Because of this, it didn't bother me in the slightest.)

Just because it is regularly regarded as nefarious doesn't mean it always is.




Can you show me this proof? And no, if someone can still unlock everything in 2 weeks, it is also quite logical that they changed it because it was too easy to unlock everything in the krypt. It should be earned, and I want to earn it. If I could get the krypt unlockable for free, I wouldn't want it. I want to do that shit myself, it is part of the game

In my opinion, they can put in micro transactions all they want as long as it doesn't affect the way the game plays for me.

What you said is logical too, but it is by no means absolute and I don't think it is worth complaining about. If it gets worse, and there actually is a paywall in the way I understand the term (You cannot get past a part of the game unless you pay) then I would be worried and complaining too. I think these micro transactions are harmless.

Case and point is I haven't touched them and am really enjoying the game, same as many other people.



It would presumably take more time (and therefore money) for them to make him playable. Not only because of his ridiculously overpowered moveset and lack of variations, but fatalities and brutalities which he obviously does not currently have.

If they just put a simple patch to make him playable the way he is (obviously not taking much time) for $5 that would be different. He would be an unfinished character, wasn't available at release even though he should have been, and there was no option to get him free, like Goro was.

@lunchbox

I agree, DLC should have meaningful content that adds to the play time. I don't even know if I will be buying the kombat pack because I haven't even had time to use all of the characters on the current roster, let alone all of there variations. But when I do, I might consider buying it, because I will get extra time from the game playing with them in practice mode and learning how to use them. Let alone the time I would spend using them in towers and online to get better with them too. To me, that is adding meaningful content.
When it comes to costumes and that kind of stuff, I have never been really interested. But it doesn't bother me, because I am just not going to pay for it. I don't care how cool an alternate costume looks, it isn't worth me paying for to have my character in the game look different.

I actually like making coins harder to get. It takes longer to unlock things increasing playtime. As far as Goro, him being sub-boss and dlc is stupid, but it's an opinion. Even if everyone in the world thinks its stupid it would still be an opinion. Business practice's like that have been around forever. They are trying to push the boundaries as far as they can go, so they can make the most off of their work. If you think they cross the line, then don't give them anything and they'll step back.

NRS has proved they listen to the fans with things like Tanya's looks and the overly sexualized designs. Just like I guarantee the next game won't have as many family members and more villains. We just have to let them know what we like and dislike.

@moneyguy

I don't think you should bother with that guy, I'm sure after you've seen his reply to what you said, you'll realize that it's really not worth wasting precious time arguing with a mindless drone.

While some people would like to use logic and deduce why certain things happen, he would much rather just throw it out the window and tell you "Show it happened".

I would hate to him as a judge in a murder case because then he'll say "Show me exactly how it happened, bring the dead body in and make it walk again so I can see exactly how it happened instead of me using my brain otherwise this guy didn't kill anybody."

If he had used his brain he'd realize that Goro is part of the game because he is the damn sub-boss.

If he had used his brain he'd realize that it wasn't a coincidence that they lowered the koin rewards and made something like "Unlock all krypt". It's just weird that he doesn't see it, lol.

If he had used his brain he'd realize that some people don't have a lot of money to waste and can't do fatalities therefore these people feel the need to buy these "Easy fatalities" which could have been something primarily in the game as a reward for completing the "Living towers" or normal "Arcade tower" instead of making you pay for it. the "Easy fatalities" in the Krypt are limited, guess why? So you can buy the "Easy fatalities".

Either way, I think neither you or I should waste our time arguing with fanboys who will protect NRS regardless of whether they are right or wrong.

If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it is one, right? If you want to remain optimistic then so be it. I don't want to consider NRS bad guys, but when they have possibly done something wrong, point it out.

If you watched the angry joe review he said it himself that the koins were patched. Its been said multiple places. You could argue either way, but think there is stronger evidence to support the former. Two weeks isn't too long to unlock 'everything'. One day, two days, or four days maybe. Its just art, costumes, mini game stuff, and fatalities/brutalities.


Okay.


Corrupted Shinnok has a fatality and brutalities. The point is, if they took him made him playable as he is now and charged you for him, that is wrong. Apparently all they must do to get away with it, would be as you said, claim to be working on him now, to get a pass on it.

@ sharefrock

Fucking pathetic. I have made it clear multiple times, unlike you, I am open to evidence. You reduce yourself to insulting me, sounding like an immature 14 year old. Grow the fuck up, and start talking like an adult or get the fuck out of here.

You're sickening. I believe in "guilty beyond a reasonable doubt", what about you? Clearly fucking not, especially when you say you hate brutalities sooooo much yet you do them every time you can and clearly fucking love them but wont admit it.

You sir, are pathetic. You can IM me if you have anything else to say so that no one else has to hear you spew bullshit and insults.



I have admitted it is arguable shady. I haven't labelled them as good guys for doing this either, Sharefrock is the one consistently inferring I am a fanboy... I never said "Oh yeah I am very happy that there are micro-transactions" or even that I like them. Not even close. I said it doesn't matter to me. I haven't bought them, I won't buy them, and it doesn't effect my game in a way I find detrimental. IF IT DID, I would agree and be complaining or doing something about it. I don't see anyone complaining about the kombat pack, In fact a lot of people are really excited for it, and want NRS to continue making more characters for the game. Supply and Demand.



Yes, I watched the review, otherwise I wouldn't be posting...

He says, yes, it doesn't mean it is true...

But that isn't an outrageous claim. I believe it, but what "evidence that supports the former"? We are both using the same evidence, which is the change in koin payouts. How is the evidence stronger for your argument?

That last part is totally your opinion. You want to have the whole Krypt unlocked in 1, 2,or 4 days? Not me, I want to work for it and explore the Krypt. I do not want to have that (rather large) part of the game done within the first week of playing the game.

I never understood why people rush through games, or pay to beat games when they could play. To me, that is pointless, but I don't care if other people that want it have it. Why pay for a game so that you can pay to beat it, and not play it?




You disagree? It bothers you when there are aspects of a game that do not change the way you play the game, or your enjoyment of it?

I get being suspicious, and wary of how far they will take it the next game. That is a valid suspicion, but if it stayed the way it is for the next game (micro-transaction wise) I would still be fine with it. What about you?

Have you payed for any of the micro-transactions?

Like I said, I understand your problem of this trend continuing into the next game and getting worse. But do you have a problem if it stays the way it is?




1 fatality. I haven't seen a brutality but sure, I believe you on that one.

He would still be massively incomplete due to the other points I made about him (especially variations).




As he is now, yes, that would be something worth complaining about.

Think about the economic side of things. Remember the other company that used to own MK? What happened there again? Oh yeah, they are bankrupt...

Well, first off, there is a difference between claiming to work on something and actually working on something. I don't take any of your guys word for it when you say something, I wouldn't take NRS's either.

If they are actually working on it, Yes, how can you argue that extra content for a game is not supposed to cost more? It takes them time and money to create it, therefore we will have to pay money to acquire it.

This works the same way for Goro too. Like I said, I am open minded, prove me wrong. Also worth mentioning I am a little biased, and most of you should be too. We got Goro for free (if you pre-ordered).

What is your response to: the game could have cost an extra $5 as opposed to giving players the option to get Goro (for free by pre-ordering) or paying the extra $5?

Again I stress that they would have to actually be working on it, not just claim it. Obviously, if they said they were working on a character but had him finished, that in itself is nefarious and shady.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/10112-Mortal-Kombat-X-Review

Yahtzee's explanation for the microtransactions is best.

I was talking about DLC practices, aka Goro, when you quoted me on this response.

You're right, we are using the same argument. Angry Joe reported it happened, and several others have reported it as well. I take what reporters say at face value, and the claims have not been denied. Again you're right. Who says what is too long or too short. For some it is convenient to unlock things in 4 days, and fun for other to unlock in a month. Either way it is painfully apparent that there is a tease there to unlock everything in 5 seconds through the micro transaction. If developers wanted you to work so hard to unlock everything, would the micro transaction be there?


Yes, it does. I don't agree when people are seeking ways to implement more money grabbing techniques, on top of other money grabbing techniques. Exploitation is not okay. I haven't paid for any MTs, but am aware of other who have. Just because a situation is not currently affecting/relevant to me does not mean that it does not matter. Observing current trends it is not unrealistic to see NRS jump on the super MT bandwagon.

I think you're still missing the point. We know Corrupted Shinnok is not finished. The point is that if they decided to(or not to) finish him tomorrow is it okay to charge everyone for him? All they have to say is we worked on him a month after release" and it becomes okay? - Where is that argument for Goro? He was literally completely done, in the exact way you described.

I'm thinking about the economic side of things. Being bankrupt is irrelevant, NRS was absorbed by big business, that is what matters. There are good and bad practices in business. Right now a lot of video game developers are taking advantage of a situation.

IMO you are making excuses for developers to be able to charge extra dollars. Pre order, where you order, when you order, if you online order, what else? Someone mentioned earlier that we paid $60 bucks for MK back in the day. Okay, well charge me $90 and cut the bs with all of this, add on when we feel like it crap. If that is what the man hours are worth, then charge it. They aren't doing that, because instead they can charge $60, add on $30, shove in skimp $2.00/$5.00 purchases here and there, and THEN next year charge you $30 for EVERYTHING. There is NO value.

So you tell me, how can you argue extra content is supposed to cost SOOOO much more, when in one year it costs less than half, plus a little extra work. (Keep in mind they added all the DLC to the krypt for the Komplete MK9, and I'm sure that took "time".)
That is "economics". I loved COD - they are shady. I loved Assassins Creed - they are shady. I stop buying when they start buying into this bs.

IIRC PC people found out the Corrupted Shinnok does have an X-ray, brutalities, and a fatality.