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Mortal Kombat II With MAME (Question)
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posted05/31/2004 08:56 PM (UTC)by
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jlacroix
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04/08/2004 09:32 PM (UTC)
Before I begin, let me just say that I hope that this is not against the rules. The majority of the users here seem to post images/combo footage from arcade versions without getting banned, so I can only assume it's okay for me to ask a question about it. Furthermore, the MKTemple (This is hosted by MKO, isn't it?) has the roms for download.

Anyway, I have a fairly decent computer:
768MB RAM
80GB 7200 HD
64MB Geforce 2
500mhz PIII
Windows XP Pro/Linux (Fedora Core 2)

The longer short of it is that I want to play MK2. I downloaded all the necessary stuff, and I can play it, but it's slow and laggy. The sound is laggy and doesn't match the action, and the FPS is extremely minimal.

Judging by the combo footage of MK3, at least SOME of you are able to play this game fluently. How? I don't think my hardware specs are a problem, judging by the fact MKII was made in the early 90's where gigahertz processors were only either on supercomputers or not even in development.

I don't have any next-gen system, so I won't be able to play Arcade Treasures unless a PC version is made, I don't have any plans of buying a next gen console anytime soon.

I absolutely can't stand ANY home conversion of MKII. To me, they all suck horribly. I want to be able to play the arcade MKII instead, do any of you have any tips or maybe better emulators that I could use to play it smoother?

Thanks!
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Konqrr
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MKII is a Glorified RPG...Turn Based Chip Damage!
 •05/30/2004 05:35 PM (UTC) •
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On that slow of a computer, you're only hope is to play without sound. Even then it most likely will not play full speed.

Get a faster computer/processor.
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jlacroix
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 •05/30/2004 06:06 PM (UTC) •
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I honestly don't think that's it, I mean it could be but I have 768MB of RAM, and with that much memory my computer FLIES. It beats a 2GHZ Athlon with the same configuration on boot up, boots 1/2 the time than the faster computer.

Doesn't RAM compensate for speed?
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dreemernj
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TheProphet, GGs my friend. Give'em Hell.

The Ultimate Source of Kompetitive Mortal Kombat. UltimateMK.com
 •05/30/2004 06:11 PM (UTC) •
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Yeah its that processor. I feel ya though, I have a p3 450 and it really isn't good enough for playing the MK games. Sound off, and offline I can do decent with it if I tweak it enough, but once I go online it is completely and totally unuseable.

My only suggestion is a small OS dedicated to mame. I have been tweaking a hacked up (and GNU Public license) version of Dos 7.1 which is the version of DOS that Win98 runs in.

I downloaded Dos 7.1 with a Win98 gui. It comes with just the 98 gui, nothing else. It runs simple win32 apps but I have been loading it with the different DLLs and such it needs to do more advanced things like use the network card and run Mame. When it boots up fresh it only uses about 7 megs of ram and everything I have gotten to work so far has gone incredibly fast, I assume because no background threads are going at all.

Hopefully I can put together a standalone CD that loads simple 98 and enough junk to make Mame and Kaillera work.

P.S. I used this setup to play some CPS2 games at about 30 fps on a Pentium 200 with 32 megs of ram :)
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jlacroix
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 •05/30/2004 07:21 PM (UTC) •
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I have something similair, I downloaded "advancemame" which is a bootcd that loads a stripped down Linux OS, with only enough to run MAME.

I am very interested in your DOS 7.1, PLEASE keep me informed that sounds awesome and very useful.
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jlacroix
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 •05/30/2004 07:23 PM (UTC) •
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Another thing, when MK2 was first released, 500mhz computers didn't even exist yet, I believe. I have a 30mhz DOS computer that I *think* came out around the same time, or a few years prior.

When MK2 came out, technology was a joke compared to now, I know the arcade didn't run on anything above 500mhz, so why does MAME have to?!
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The_Purple_Bunny
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BunnyHaetsU - Ramblings of a man who probably shouldn't be allowed into society.

 •05/30/2004 07:33 PM (UTC) •
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jlacroix Wrote:
Another thing, when MK2 was first released, 500mhz computers didn't even exist yet, I believe. I have a 30mhz DOS computer that I *think* came out around the same time, or a few years prior.

When MK2 came out, technology was a joke compared to now, I know the arcade didn't run on anything above 500mhz, so why does MAME have to?!


This is the exact answer from MAME's official site:

In emulation world, megahertz is not analogous from your main CPU to the emulated CPU. MAME not only rigorously emulates every opcode of the emulated CPU(s), but also memory interfaces, video output and sound emulation, and all this in portable C code.

Simply, because you have a single PC processor attempting to emulate not only video rom chips but also sound chips and the rest of the hardware that the arcade game runs on. Add to the fact that MK2 on arcade runs at 53 MHz, and PC monitors don't (the reason for sound not syncing with video), and you get the reason for the need of a very fast computer. MAME also is not made for your playing pleasure. It's made for accurate hardware emulation, and if that means changing drivers to emulate hardware more accurately at the cost of performance, then that's what they're gonna do.
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InviladNoobWarrior
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<------- A TRUE SAIYA-JIN RIGHT THERE

 •05/30/2004 08:09 PM (UTC) •
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so basically what purple bunny is sayin is that if the total amount of processor power for mk2 arcade runs at um.....200mhz (im makin up a number) you're gonna need to at least have double the processor power to even try and run it smooth enough, ram wont do u any good if your processor is less than 500mhz. especially for somethin like umk3
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The_Purple_Bunny
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BunnyHaetsU - Ramblings of a man who probably shouldn't be allowed into society.

 •05/30/2004 08:15 PM (UTC) •
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MK2 runs nowhere near 200 MHz. The CPU runs at 6.25 MHz, and the sound runs at 10 MHz, with a 53.2 Hz screen. It takes around a 1.5 - 2 GHz PC processor to emulate all that and the hardware so that the games run smoothly, so there's nothing about doubling the frequency, otherwise, that's like saying the arcade PCB runs at 750 MHz if you need a 1.5 GHz to emulate it.
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MK2KungBroken
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The Prophet - R.I.P. 1979-2006www.kombatnetwork.com
- Your Source for UMK3 Competition -
When something better than UMK3 comes out, I'll let you all know, because it still hasn't happened yet.
 •05/30/2004 08:17 PM (UTC) •
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Bottom line, you need at least a P4 1 ghz to run MK2 smoothly with sound on, and I think around 1.2 or more to run MK3 smoothly, with sound on. It's all about processing power, you only need about 256 megs of ram to run your OS, background programs, MAME, and an MK game.

Matt
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danadbab
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Hello

•05/30/2004 09:23 PM (UTC) •
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500mhz PIII this is ur problem.. its time to upgrade ur computer!!!
I play MK2 with full settings fullscreen, draw everyframe with a: Dell Dimension 8200 1.8ghz (upgradable to 2.6) Pentium 4, 768MB Samsung/Dell Certified DDR, Radeon 9800XT (Overdrive *on), all on a crisp Dell 18' 1800FP Display (flatscreen).

lol. You need a Pentium 4 HT 3.0 Etreme with all of the above to play Killer Instinct 2 properly. At least MAME's code. KI2 on U64emu has jotty on sound mine, unplayable with MAME, but KI1 is perfect. As well as all the MK's.

I have a question also speaking of MK2 and MAME. Could anyone here guide me to a proper version (the more commonly used) of MAMEkaillera and also how to get into the room that people here usually play on?
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Jason Shearer
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 •05/30/2004 11:04 PM (UTC) •
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wingsofredemption Wrote:
I play MK2 with full settings fullscreen, draw everyframe with a: Dell Dimension 8200 1.8ghz (upgradable to 2.6) Pentium 4, 768MB Samsung/Dell Certified DDR, Radeon 9800XT (Overdrive *on), all on a crisp Dell 18' 1800FP Display (flatscreen).


All that computer, yet you use AOL? Shame.
Never really showed me any BS. I have AOL for broadband now, and while the new Special Edition uses less memory and uses faster netcode (a ping of about 40 on BattleField vietnam). Also, I was on kaillera (to my dismay, NO MK games could be found) and I had a ping in the 0-40's also. Not bad I'd say.

Comparison showed that cable (around here, COX cable) was indeed fairly faster, mainly for online gaming and downloads from webpages/emails/webrowsing.. but was prone to more popups (meaning we need to use popup blocking programs) as well as problems with media programs like Kazaa and Bittorrent..

The Broadband Blaster that AOL gave to me can be hooked up through USB or Ethernet. Mines through USB and it still gets those pings of 40 in my online gaming and fast this and that etc..

Decent download speeds, incredible web browsing, NO popups, NO spam, superb online gaming. Never a problem for the 3 PC's I went through since '97. I'm not dogging other connections, if I had it my way I'd be sailing on one of the T's. And cable is not bad.. just that AOL isn't either.
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jlacroix
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 •05/31/2004 12:09 AM (UTC) •
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I will, someday, upgrade my Computer. (Right now, I have bills to pay) For now, I want a way around this, if there is one. Is there a MAME version that doesn't need to double the processing power?

I appreciate everyone's help and understanding.

When it comes to Linux though, it seems to run the games a bit faster, although it may be just me.
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dreemernj
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TheProphet, GGs my friend. Give'em Hell.

The Ultimate Source of Kompetitive Mortal Kombat. UltimateMK.com
 •05/31/2004 02:05 AM (UTC) •
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jlacroix Wrote:
I will, someday, upgrade my Computer. (Right now, I have bills to pay) For now, I want a way around this, if there is one. Is there a MAME version that doesn't need to double the processing power?

I appreciate everyone's help and understanding.

When it comes to Linux though, it seems to run the games a bit faster, although it may be just me.


Some versions of Linux probably will seem faster. Windows in general is so full of garbage and is so inefficient that it saps your computers resources. Really, processor makers and MS I think work together, one makes a faster processor to make an OS go faster and then the OS becomes more feature filled and inefficient so you need a better processor, on and on until everyone has an OS that uses 1 gb of ram and has a 10 ghz computer.

I suggest sticking with Linux. If not search for the simplified Windows systems and try them out. DOS 7.1 can load Win 3.1, Win 3.11, win 95, win 98, and win me front ends. The front ends range is size from about 2 megs for 3.1 to about 15 megs for ME. Win 98 is about 9 megs to DL.

Setting it up to run mame and kaillera can be very tricky, but then again setting up Linux can be tricky sometimes as well.
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InviladNoobWarrior
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<------- A TRUE SAIYA-JIN RIGHT THERE

 •05/31/2004 02:52 AM (UTC) •
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i was just usin assumptions with what i was sayin, sorry to seem inaccurate with it. but to run mame games u do need alot of power. i use to have a p4 1.6, 256 ddr ram, win xp and every mk game (except umk3 sometimes) ran perfectly. but when i upgraded my pc (i had to cause my old motherboard died sad) to a amd xp 2600+, 512 ddr ram, and win xp everything ran so much smoother, including umk3 wit programs runnin in the background. basically mame requires alot of computer power. im just babbling lol dont mind me
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megatron187
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 •05/31/2004 08:28 AM (UTC) •
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Hi dude I have a Pentium III 1.13G with 376 MB ram in my computer. I tryed playing MK II and MK 3 on my computer they played like crap, but I found this version of mame that ran them great for me with sound on. Do a google search for this version of mame StretchMAME 0.65. MK II and Mk3 work great for me now with this version of mame. Try it it may run the mks good on your computer.
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CorrezZ
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Reiko = S.U.V.

 •05/31/2004 09:12 AM (UTC) •
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I only have a 1.3 Ghz AMD Duron with 128 MB of RAM, and all MK's run fine with sounds as well as online. I have never upgraded it, but I really need some more RAM, (Media Player + Mame + Overnet = extreme slowness)
By the way, older MAME versions like 0.64 or 0.67 runs MK games faster than the newer Versions (for me).

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The_Purple_Bunny
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BunnyHaetsU - Ramblings of a man who probably shouldn't be allowed into society.

 •05/31/2004 07:54 PM (UTC) •
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KillerMiller Wrote:
By the way, older MAME versions like 0.64 or 0.67 runs MK games faster than the newer Versions (for me).



Up to .67 will MK games run smoothly on at least 800 MHz. This is because the sound system was hacked to force the game to run at 60 Hz (PC monitor speed) instead of 53.2 Hz.
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dreemernj
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TheProphet, GGs my friend. Give'em Hell.

The Ultimate Source of Kompetitive Mortal Kombat. UltimateMK.com
 •05/31/2004 08:56 PM (UTC) •
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The_Purple_Bunny Wrote:

KillerMiller Wrote:
By the way, older MAME versions like 0.64 or 0.67 runs MK games faster than the newer Versions (for me).



Up to .67 will MK games run smoothly on at least 800 MHz. This is because the sound system was hacked to force the game to run at 60 Hz (PC monitor speed) instead of 53.2 Hz.


Yeah I've actually gotten quite good performance from UMK3 w/sound on a P3 733 128mb win98 comp as long as I used .60 or .64.
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